Two questions remain after reading this: How did you keep all your brain cells through the course of reading all that (or did you??? no offense to the Twilight fans, my friends among them, but it is rather difficult for the rest of us), and how long did it take before you went running to the nearest work of eloquence to wash the pain away?
I think its rediculous the way the book talks about there romance so much..It was rather sickening lol, and your right now that i think of it.. it never did have much details on what was going on. But I liked vampires before the book even came out, I think they are cool and I dont think people who hate twilight should hate vampires in general, because not all vampires are from the book.
Im starting to really hate the book since its making people write articles about how much the authors visions of vampires suck.
Y'know, I never understood women's sexual fascination with vampires, especially with all those other monsters available. Werewolves are like primal beefcakes, wizards and warlocks can work wonders with their magic, and genies will grant your every wish. But vampires? They're basically intelligent, non-rotting zombies that want your blood instead of your brains. It's basically necrophilia.
I read in a mythology book about vampires that there is indeed a myth explaining why. They stated that "A vampire's bite is more pleasurable than sex itself." I am sure some other authors took advantage of that myth(including me).
Amen to this.
It's true, the whole story was becoming convenient, ESPECIALLY at the end. They all came for this "war", and guess what happens? NO WAR. Everything goes back to normal and everyone is happy.
I hated when Bella had no hardship to overcome from her transition from human to vampire. Bleh. It wasn't even worthy of "epic fail" at that point.
Bella's obsession is extremely ridiculous as you have already pointed out. Of course Edward will do anything to protect her. I mean, she's a complete idiot right? And so is he.
And then the imprinting... omg. I just wanted to claw my eyes out and burn the book right then. All for convenience, of course. This story was a complete fairy tale. A waste of time.
I've heard that the ending for the New Moon movie is supposed to be different from the book. Maybe something interesting will actually happen. But I doubt it. I doubt it.
First of all, thank you for this essay. Quite a few of my friends are die-hard fangirls over Edward and I never get a clear reason why from them, so this essay that you wrote gives me a better picture at what they're looking at. Now that I have a better understanding of "who" he is from the rebuttal, I can confidently say that they're raving over nothing. (Admittedly, I have no room to talk with how I fangirl over a few choice fictional characters, but at least I derive an intelligent reason for it after throughoully looking at their character AND I don't bother going to the trouble of worshipping those characters.)
Another reason why I thank you is because those same friends of mine have been bugging me to read thes series. My two main reasons for putting it off is because it's a vampire romance novel (which I feel heavy skeptisism towards because of how easily those stories turn into tales of pure lust *cough-cough-True Blood*) and because of the negative side of the fandom. No offense, you Twilight lovers out there, but the over-the-top obsession is creeping me out! Now that I've read your essay--which is the first intelligent negative view of the series that I've read, by the way--I don't feel as indecisive in my decision to not pick up the books altogether.
On a final note, I have to say that the whole concept of marriage being the pennacle of a woman's life and that she be submissive to her husband is rather out-dated by our culture's standards. Don't get me wrong, marriage and cooperation with your spouse is still highly encouraged, but in my opinion that shouldn't come without, as you put it, a balance between the two. (Please note that I don't have personal greviences against the LDS church. Truth be told, I don't know enough about the LDS church to have an opinion on it.)
The first two were an interesting read in my opinion, I thought the story was pretty okay, it occupied me for a while without losing my attention the first time around. But as I thought about it again recently, I've noticed even more prominence in the lack of dynamic characters. There's no depth to anyone, nobody changes, and the author put a nice little ribbon on the end to satisfy everyone so that they're happy.
Jacob doesn't fight for Bella, he protects the 'abomination' that not only goes against everything he stands for, but also must cause him great pains, Bella becomes perfect immediately, yadda yadda.
It was like gagging on dry grits after looking past the glittery surface into the matte stale white canvas below.
Twilight is just one of the many examples that effort =/= sales... they have worked out that just about everyone thinks the same and they're using it to their advantage by using cliche's that are widely popular... they're not going to put effort into it because as soon as they do, they have a smaller audience... some wont like what extra effort was put in and some will. The bad thing about everyone liking similar things is everyone will be influenced by similar things, therefore ending up thinking the same things, losing our independence that makes humans, well humans. Twilight for example has increased the amount of vampire fans, now the majority are into vampires. And i could go on more about what else is influencing people to all think the same but it's off topic.
Queen of Termina (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/26/09 | Reply
Your essay put a new perspective on this overhyped series. I CANNOT stand Twilight, and my friends and family are absolutely in love with it. I'm so glad other people think it sucks as bad as I do.
Hmmmm. well, one character Alice has been known to freak out and play "dolly" with bella! I mean, they could all use the excuse, "well, uh...Alice went a little crazy with the glitter lotion this morning and now it's everywhere...i mean, everywhere."
^-^ arts and crafts...i'd like to cut up one of the books and turn it into paper dolls! or better yet, a paper child cringing in fear of the words that contain so many adjectives and the word "perfect" an infinite number of times.
OMFG O_O
....i love this....
AND I LOVE YOU!! *not in the wrong way...lawl*
i thought it was kinda cool how you kept really professional throughout the whole thing.
i dont care that it was lengthy, the way you wrote it made it flow easily so it didn't seem that long either way.
this essay just seriously made my day
Last edited by Lizinator03 at 7:42:42 AM EDT on April 26, 2009.
I Whole heartedly say, its a disgrace to literature and film making..its not great, its not good, it's just a poorly made waste of paper made of a crazy person. This is just a RUMOR but the author was said to have been hearing voices whilst writing them...
Exactly! If everything worked perfectly before, why did you have to go and take it apart to make some new craptraption?!?! However, Meyer thought that with one bite and a lil' bit of venom, everything works out fine! Wrong! For dracula, it took him a bite night for a month. For others in say, Anne Rice or Amelia Atwater-Rhodes, it took the blood exchange. There's a reason why there are myths and legends and why nobody tries to completely stab them throught the heart with a stake, drain out all of their blood, cut off their head, stuff its mouth full of garlic, dump it in broad-daylight, sprinkle holy water over it and dismember it, finally burning the pieces separately and scattering the ashes to the wind. (That should just about cover all the ways to kill a vampire) They've been thought out before a hundred million times, had editors with brains, and people actually believe them...or at least they used to.
Oh, and I must say one more thing: sparkles....I don't get it. Yeah, it's meant to be pretty, but I don't know how that was supposed to repulse Bella. maybe she would've thought "Oh my god, my boyfriend's gay?!" (i don't mean to offend anyone who's gay by trying to compare edward to you.) But no, she just stands there saying, "ooh, shiny!" Let's look at sparkles in a scientific way. How will sparkles help/hurt edward? First of all, he can be spotted easily if he steps into the sun: easy target, bam! fail. Secondly: who is going to run away from a sparkly guy? Not too many people. If it's supposed to be a warning mechanism like the colors of poison dart frogs, than it's a fail. So many people would just point and laugh instead of running. However, now that I think about it, maybe the sparkles are supposed to draw the weak-minded, shallow, ADD/ADHD victims (aka Bella) toward them and entrance them with their "perfect beauty" so they can pounce! But I highly doubt that's what Meyer was going for. She probably just wanted to make "perfect" edward even more "perfect" by making him pretty. A bad attempt at shojo sparkles perhaps? Personally, I'd laugh in his face and think that his scintillating skin just makes him even more of a wimp than he already is.
The problem with the idea that a vampire can turn you with 3 bites in a month or less is that the vampire population would grow ridiculously fast. That makes a one-bite turn policy an autofail.
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/23/09 | Reply
@:
However, I must warn you, while it is interesting and informative, the essay is incredibly long.
I'm sure I can manage it. After all, this essay here, if I had attempted to cover everything, would have easily been twice as long. Seriously though, so long as it's interesting, long is not an issue, so if you remember the link, post it.
I must say, I kinda agree with you here: that meyer totally disregarded all previous mythos and threw it out the window. I do like the idea that she tried (key word) to "freshen it up". However, she started adding too much crap that even she couldn't keep track of or develop. The one thing that REALLY ticks me off is the whole "one-bite turns you" theory. Even Dracula couldn't do that: it took a series of bites, usually about a month, of the vampire biting the prospective human. Another popular method is a sort of blood exchange: the vampire drinks the human's blood, and in turn the human drinks the vampire's. One major flaw in the whole one-bite thing is that if there are, idk, twenty or so vamps that we know of in the volturi (the "evil" group of vamps), and they've been around for hundreds of years: they either have to kill all of their prey or let them turn into vamps, which in turn could create even more vamps: Thereby creating a dcrease in the human population, i.e. food source, and eventually humans would be hunted into extinction and the vampires would die of starvation or turn to cannibalism. Meyer obviously didn't think this through. If a teeenager can point out the flaw in fifteen minutes and meyer (or her editor) can't even see what's wrong with it, or try to fix it, then that's knda pathetic. oh, and i must say that i found all of the characters flat and with no background, yes even edward and bella. we never really get to know anyone. like someone else said before: bella doesn't even know edward's favorite color! that's pathetic! btw, Markus Wolfe, i read your comments on some other essay Twilight: The Root of All Evil, and you pwn!
...i'm done now...^.^
Last edited by Gaijin otome at 8:04:17 PM EDT on April 24, 2009.
And apparently Twilight is just a story that the author stole from her friend, and rewrote as an even worse version. which is why her ass is getting sued.
So she was a mormon, hey??? And apparently Twilight is just a story that the author stole from her friend, and rewrote as an even worse version. which is why her ass is getting sued. Apparently. At any rate, I think that if the relationship between Edward and Bella was real it'd be just like the relationship an addict has to crack. Why? because it seems more destructive then anything else, this creepy co-dependency with some chick who has a morbid obsessession with a guy who wants to suck her blood/maim her. It's falling in love with a psychotic stalker who you know nothing about. A relationship like that in the real world wouldn't last. One of the reasons it's so stink. luff x
But I will stand by my Hulk comparison. Werewolves equate to beserkers in combat, and would probably gobble up vampires on both sides. It would be a very dangerous alliance for the vampires involved, one that would only be taken as a final desperate defense.
Well I wasn't saying your analogy was wrong. I think we are both have the same point really, Meyer's execution or rather means of using it in the story was poorly done. That is the very heart of her failure in this series, using things and yet not bothering to give it any real depth.
It's just a convenient means for her to move the plot forward. If she wants to have the vampires and werewolves able to co exist like that, then she needs a much broader and more in-depth background for the mythos of both of them.
Or rather they need more than some stupid kid switching sides and able to handle it so easily. It was all too pat and easy for them to do what they did. So I think it's possible, but not how she did it.
I will also stand by my fourth statement. It is my understanding that there have been many changes in the symbolism of vampire's since Dracula was first published, but werewolf lore is relatively adamant.
I found it disappointing that she had a different mythos for the vampires and yet never did anything with it other than to move things along. The same with the werewolves. Also, if the lore has pretty much never changed, then surely it's a good reason to finally do so.
However, one thing I'm sure we can both firmly agree on, is that Meyer's is not the author to do it. She never went beyond superficial danger and change in her story, ever.
I love when authors take the time to switch things up instead of relying on what others before them have done. But not when they don't bother to actually make it believable. The series fails on so many levels that it's sad.
Anyway... At least we both agree that the books are a waste of time. =P
I AGREE FULLY! I don't hate vampires, but neither do I like them. It's more of...a "mweh" feeling from them. But I do hate cliches, and most vampire stories are filled with cliches.
(I am the only girl my age that thinks that way apparently, or at least, in my school, it's so frustrating!! ><)
Sorry about that. Sometimes the testosterone gets to my head.
Yeah, most of my stuff was bigoted. But I will stand by my Hulk comparison. Werewolves equate to beserkers in combat, and would probably gobble up vampires on both sides. It would be a very dangerous alliance for the vampires involved, one that would only be taken as a final desperate defense.
I will also stand by my fourth statement. It is my understanding that there have been many changes in the symbolism of vampire's since Dracula was first published, but werewolf lore is relatively adamant.
I think this one sentence in your essay sums things up perfectly.
This isn’t a true love; this is a dysfunctional dance between two individuals who have never grown up.
I've heard similar sentiments from other people who have read the books and based on what you've written, it sounds terrible. The next time some of my other LDS friends try to get me to read them, I'm going to link them to this instead. I don't mind romance stories, but if they're as poorly done as this, no thanks.
Anyway, nice work with going into why you didn't like it. So much better than the usual 'it sucks' nonsense that I hear from others. And nice work with your comment responses too. =P
>__>
Oh....ehehe..
I'm sorry, again. I shouldn't have said that you'd been saying things about something that you didn't know about, and I'm sorry. That was really rude of me.
But you're right, I shouldn't take it personal. I guess I kind of took it the wrong way and I thought that the author was attacking the church as a whole (which I don't really know why, because they really weren't). That's another reason to apologize.
I wouldn't feel to bad. After all, you had no way of knowing that I used to be a member of that religion. That and text doesn't convey very well if someone is being serious or sarcastic. So I can see how my comment could be taken either way. So no worries. ^_^
I only have a few things to say in response to your comment and as a result, I’ll only be quoting a few spots since most of what you’ve got up isn’t relevant. Anyway, starting here:
First, werewolves teaming up with vampires to defeat a greater enemy is sort of like the Hulk being a member of the Avengers.
The point I was getting at was that it was contrived to drive the plot forward, not that such a thing would never happen. It’s all in the storytelling and execution really.
Second, imprinting? Seriously.
The concept of imprinting isn’t the issue; it was, again, the execution. I’m not here to mindlessly bash the author when she had some creative ideas to begin with. Also, don’t try and think you’re somehow better at it. Every author, including yourself and the one you’re bashing, has their reason or excuse for why it’s okay that they did things a certain way.
Which brings us to the third point of malcontent: the relationship of Bella and Edward. Open your mouth and say holy shit, perfect couple much?
Perfect couple? I’m thinking you completely missed my point. They were anything but perfect, unless you mean perfectly dysfunctional and obsessive. Real couples are supposed to balance each other out. Bella and Edward did not; they were too enmeshed in each other to be capable of doing so.
Fourth issue: That stupid bitch totally disregarded the ancient symbolism that is werewolves and vampires! One is the primal, instinctual side of humanity, the murderous beast that lives in the heart of every man, no matter how civilized. The other is vicious revenge from the grave, sucking humanity dry.
Now here’s where you’re just being absurd. If every vampire and werewolves mythos story out there was the same, there would be no point in reading them since it would be the same tired old story but with different names. The author may have written a poor romance novel, but she was anything but stupid.
And last....LDS religion? I don't know what that is, but I DON'T like the sound of it.
Google is your friend, hell I even provided a link in one of the comments here. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints This article is not a bash on this religion, but merely showing how I think the author allowed it to influence her writing style. To even attempt to judge an entire religion based on one author, would be the very height of arrogance and stupidity.
So seriously, try to be more objective and less biased in your observations.
~Crystia
Last edited by Indi at 6:07:20 PM EDT on April 21, 2009.
Your manner of speech utterly robs you of any credibility you might have otherwise had. Regardless of whether or not you and I agree on taste, you have just provided a clear and resounding example of why there is a bitter feud over this series.
Y'know, I never understood women's sexual fascination with vampires, especially with all those other monsters available. Werewolves are like primal beefcakes, wizards and warlocks can work wonders with their magic, and genies will grant your every wish. But vampires? They're basically intelligent, non-rotting zombies that want your blood instead of your brains. It's basically necrophilia.
First, werewolves teaming up with vampires to defeat a greater enemy is sort of like the Hulk being a member of the Avengers: It's great when he's pounding the enemy to paste, but he'll probably turn on you when he's finished.
Second, imprinting? Seriously. I admit to using it in a fanfic once, but that was Kiba Inuzuka imprinting on a very sexy lady, and that happens in real life. Their love will not be realized by some shitty "Can't bear to be apart." Notion (Kiba DOES spend 2 or so years at without seeing her, or her seeing him, and, although they do miss each other, they get along just fine) NO! I would prefer to sum it up as "Life and all it's joys are way better when you can share them with someone else, and that someone else is you, babe." Sure, he almost commits a double suicide with her, but that's more too do with guilt for killing the woman he promised to never hurt. (Considering that Kiba's morals rely heavily on his loyalty, this is quite realistic)
Which brings us to the third point of malcontent: the relationship of Bella and Edward. Open your mouth and say holy shit, perfect couple much? Not only are they the perfect couple, but they redefine perfect couple. See, I have 2 definitions of a perfect couple:
A) The conflicting attributes, personalities and abilities of the individual members of a couple cancel out (or at least temper) the negative aspects of the couple, and combine so that they are greater than the sum of their abilities. I like to think of this as Kagome and Inuyasha's relationship: His raw destructive and physical powers compensate for Kagome's....human....ness....while she can keep Inuyasha's anger in check and use spiritual abilities.
B)A couple with no major potential issues.
See, these two were custom made for each other by the author, so..... yeah.
Fourth issue: That stupid bitch totally disregarded the ancient symbolism that is werewolves and vampires! One is the primal, instinctual side of humanity, the murderous beast that lives in the heart of every man, no matter how civilized. The other is vicious revenge from the grave, sucking humanity dry.
And last....LDS religion? I don't know what that is, but I DON'T like the sound of it.
>__>
Oh....ehehe..
I'm sorry, again. I shouldn't have said that you'd been saying things about something that you didn't know about, and I'm sorry. That was really rude of me.
But you're right, I shouldn't take it personal. I guess I kind of took it the wrong way and I thought that the author was attacking the church as a whole (which I don't really know why, because they really weren't). That's another reason to apologize.
.__.
And thanks to SunfallE for fixing my comment. It kinda freaked me out when the entire first half was gone. O__o
I feel like a huge loser right about now.
Aaaahhh...it's nice ot find other people who dislike the series Twilight. Though I have never read the book (no force in the world can make me) my friends' feed backs on it makes me want to burn every book in that series when I see it. In my opinion, the book wrecks the image of a vampire. How does Bella get pregnant because of Edward if he's DEAD?!
I love this essay! I finally have something to throw at my friends when they say that I should read this book before I say that I hate it.
But I do have one question, what exactly is LDS? I know you've said it was a religion, but I honestly have no fathomable idea what you're talking about. If you could explain a little bit that would be great in understanding your essay even more.
It's a little more politically correct term for what is commonly known as the Mormon religion. You can read up on it here at Wiki: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints It would take too long for me to go into depth on it.
Very well written and your points were explained fantastically. Very persuasive, but as someone said, maybe try to cut it down a page. But other than that great, like I said, you even have me re evaluating the book!
I'm glad you enjoyed it. I think it was me who talked about cutting it down since I did do that. If I had included everything I could talk about and had taken the time to go into depth with the comparisons, it could have easily been twice as long. So I went through and trimmed it down for clarity's sake instead. lol
First I'll say that I'm a casual fan of the series, but, reading your essay has got me thinking about the story and it's story.
But your ananlysis about Bella is spot on as well as Edward. Personally I thought they were both too overly clingy, Edward too protective and Bella too whiny, and the ending horribly cliche (as you've stated already).
I think there has always been a fasination with vampires, honestly, I don't understand why, but there has. Most girls now a days lust for something that is seemingly wrong but right, the "in love with a vampire" fits that ticket and fulfils that.
What bothers me just is more of the crazy fans who seem to have taken the story a bit too far. Some girl almost punched me for saying I didn't like Edward! It's become almost a cult following for the story!
But I do have one question, what exactly is LDS? I know you've said it was a religion, but I honestly have no fathomable idea what you're talking about. If you could explain a little bit that would be great in understanding your essay even more.
Very well written and your points were explained fantastically. Very persuasive, but as someone said, maybe try to cut it down a page. But other than that great, like I said, you even have me re evaluating the book!
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/20/09 | Reply
@:
New Moon on the other hand ....
So now I wonder, did you read beyond the first page? Because I covered all of the series (including New Moon) and wrapped things up on page five with my final thoughts.
I'm afraid I must agree, I've read them all, and kept thinking to myself, "Is he nuts? All he's ever done is stalk her, or try not to eat her, She doesn't even know what his favorite color is! where is all this devotion coming from?" While it is interesting at first, it is far two drawn out, and all the character seem copy-pasted together. And of course, the icing on the cake, the movie, was 5 times as pathetic.
And we wonder why our girls think they can do as they please and it won't matter! ><
Thanks for FINALLY providing a realstic, non-bashing, objective opinion. It was incredably refreshing.
AH man, I totally agree with what you say and everything you mean! It was just an awful series dripping with angst and blind love, meant to capture the typical person's interest and give them the christmas present they knew they'd get. *sigh* It was quite predictable, ne?
Even sadder... Meyer's rewriting the first book from Edward's perspective... Yeah, Stephanie, just keep kicking that dead horse...
I've always been able to edit or delete any comment on the site. o_O In this case, an unclosed tag makes IE users unable to respond, so fixing it is kind of necessary. All I did was add three / in the appropriate spots. =P It's really no different than you being able to edit posts at OB you know. *pokes you*
I went ahead and fixed the italics tags since that can make it difficult for other people when it comes to being able to comment. Just so you know, you left three of them unclosed.
Um, do you have to be that harsh about it?
I read all the books-and I got really tired of them-and I know that Meyer is a member of the LDS church. I am as well, and I think that was a rather...insensitive thing to say about our religion. I am
definitely not defending Meyer in any way, but...I think it's rude to say something like that about a church so large just because one author wrote a book series and she happens to be LDS.
Even if that one author's book series happened to really suck.
I was referring to the sentiments and comparisons that were brought up in this article (not the LDS church as a whole) and yes I'm going to be that harsh about it. I'll clarify why in a moment here since it pertains to the other part of your comment here:
:3 I hope I don't come off really rude or anything. Your comment just really offended me, and I thought I should tell you that, even if I never talk to you again. It seemed like you were making a sudden stamement about someone because of their religion, or something like that. That you were making a statement about a church that you haven't been going to your whole life...If that makes sense at all.
Again, I apologize if I have offended you in any way or if I have taken your comment the wrong way and/or misunderstood it. I just felt that I should explain something. :3
See here's the thing. I'm 16 and I was born and raised in the LDS church. I didn't stop going until shortly before I turned 14. So I'm not some outsider who isn't familiar with it. I've been a part of it just as long as you were. So moving to this part here:
I'm thirteen, fourteen in August. But I ask that nobody use it against me when I say I've been going to the LDS church my whole life and say that "It's only thirteen years," because that's probably thirteen years more than you have. :3 Thank you.
Based on my previous clarification, I can make the same claim in terms of years/experience since nearly 14 years out of 16 is pretty close to my entire life. But the real point is that, like the article, it is my opinion and nothing more. I wouldn't take it personal, seriously.
Oh and you might want to edit your comment. You forgot to close an italics tag so it's messing up the rest of the comments. o_O
~*Aaryanna*~
EDIT: One other thing, if it wasn't clear, some of my tone in my original comment was me being sarcastic. Just so you know.
Last edited by Aaryanna at 9:56:20 PM EDT on April 19, 2009.
O_____o
Um, do you have to be that harsh about it?
I read all the books-and I got really tired of them-and I know that Meyer is a member of the LDS church. I am as well, and I think that was a rather...insensitive thing to say about our religion. I am
definitely not defending Meyer in any way, but...I think it's rude to say something like that about a church so large just because one author wrote a book series and she happens to be LDS.
Even if that one author's book series happened to really suck.
:3 I hope I don't come off really rude or anything. Your comment just really offended me, and I thought I should tell you that, even if I never talk to you again. It seemed like you were making a sudden stamement about someone because of their religion, or something like that. That you were making a statement about a church that you haven't been going to your whole life...If that makes sense at all.
Again, I apologize if I have offended you in any way or if I have taken your comment the wrong way and/or misunderstood it. I just felt that I should explain something. :3
As for the article, I agree with the parts that do not judge Meyer's writing for her religion and that talk about the actual text. You did a really good job describing why you do not like Twilight and why you think that the author did a bad (for lack of a better word) job on writing it. (:
Also...for anybody that was wondering?
I'm thirteen, fourteen in August. But I ask that nobody use it against me when I say I've been going to the LDS church my whole life and say that "It's only thirteen years," because that's probably thirteen years more than you have. :3 Thank you.
Last edited by SunfallE at 10:41:22 PM EDT on April 19, 2009.
That honestly sounds terrible. I had no interest in reading it before and I certainly have none now. It's a pity that popularity doesn't mean something is actually any good.
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/14/09 | Reply
@:
Your comparisons to the LDS religion are so accurate. It's kind of disgusting. -_- Most of my friends who are active LDS members love the book because it fits so well with their religious beliefs. As for me, I'm not a fan of vampire stories in general so I rather liked the changes made to the myths but like you pointed out, none of that was actually developed or used well unless it was convenient to the plot. And for me the author never developed the most interesting characters in the series. I felt the second book was just a waste and didn't add anything to the series at all.
Yeah, I can see that. I have friends who are and they sing praises of this series. I can see the potential in the story, but that's about it. Also, I find it highly ironic that people bash the areas where the author had creativity and yet did little to develop it. Instead of following the standard mythos, she branched off and tried to do something else. It's just a pity that she never bothered to actually develop any of that.
For me the stupidest thing was in the fourth book where Bella gets pregnant,is physically struggling and it was Jacob, the werewolf, not Carlisle, the vampire and medical doctor for hundreds of years, who first thinks that Bella's baby needs blood for both of them to survive. It was such an obvious answer to the problem and yet not one of the vampires thought of it or considered blood as being the solution to Bella being so sick. It was so stupid and seemed like just another way inject Jacob in the storyline.
Not only was that utterly stupid, I found the aspect about how their bodies come to a halt being tossed aside painfully stupid as well. Because if you think about it, really think about how the author portrayed this story then you have to come to the following conclusion:
There's no way Edward could have gotten her pregnant, his body would have come to a halt too, including producing the sperm necessary to even get her pregnant to begin with. That's another one of the author's convenient loopholes that she used to create drama.
So although there were aspects of the storyline of the series that I did like, the author just never went anywhere with it. I think you summed the series up rather well.
On that we are both agreed. It's kind of sad to see someone have a potentially good idea and yet completely ruin it in the execution.
You're right about the comparison's. We exist to grow up and have babies!
*shoots the LDS church*
I don't regret leaving that behind. That kind of mindset is just BLECH. I don't plan on reading this anytime soon. I don't like romance anyway. And this sounds horrible, especially the fourth book. Ugh. =_=
o_o You weren't kidding when you said you were going to go into detail about it. As much as I like the series, I do like that you took the time to say why you didn't like it. I get so tired of the people who just say it sucks and don't bother to say why they think it does.
We don't agree, but that's okay. I just wish everyone would be more polite about it like you were. I hope that makes sense. ^^
I've seen the movie since one of my friends like this series. o_O I wasn't very impressed with the movie so I never bothered to pick up the book to read. Based on the summaries you given... It sounds like something I wouldn't care for.
Also, I cannot deny the sentiment that marriage is considered more important than other things in the LDS religion. ^^ However, not everyone thinks total subservience is acceptable. Though sadly, some do and you are actually looked down on if you don't agree.
I'm already getting a certain amount of 'what's wrong with you' from people since I'm going to be 24 and I'm in college, and not married yet. =_= I kind of find that a bit offensive since I think life should be balanced instead of centered on just one thing.
Then there's always the deal that to a certain extent, when you do or don't get married is no one else's business. Anyway, it was an interesting read and if anything, it only confirms my decision to never bother to read the books.
I mean, popular books which make those who aren't into reading before want to read those books =3 well, I have to admit that some popular books are also great ^___^
I think what makes me reluctant to read Twilight in the very first place is its genre >___< happily-ever-after romance isn't my thing... (exceptions for Gone with the Wind and Scarlett, they're amazing =3). And when I watched the movie, the plot seems really boring...=3
Anyway, that's just my thoughts... (plus, writing lots of sentences like this can help me improve my English XD)
And you're welcome! ^___^
Yeah. I remember having a conversation with one of my cousins, and she talked about the pressure she felt that she was expected to find a nice missionary boy to marry. ._.
I have an aunt who is LDS, so I'm familiar with the things you were talking about.
Oh good, someone who understands what I was getting at. If you're at all familiar with it, then it's easier to see what I was getting at. It's a pity so few people will actually get that aspect. Or they'll be offended by the obvious implications from it.
Don't I know it. It totally fits the OMG U DON'T UNDERSTAND ME mentality that's so prevalent these days. The author tries to pretend otherwise, but it's pretty damn clear in the series. And probably another reason why it's so popular... The kids are OMG I KNOW HOW THEY FEEL! *headesk*
I'm so confused though. Not because of your writing, just because even from the short summaries you gave the plot just seems so disconnected.
I'm not surprised, the story was too predictable so there was no real plot beyond them ending up together. I left some things out, because like you said, I was trying to keep it concise. I hit 3,700+ words and yet it could have easily been twice that length.
The author spent way too much time inserting contrived drama instead of giving them a real reason to love one another. Even with the stuff I left out, it's still pretty bland and boring as hell.
I wouldn't recommend reading it to see what I didn't cover though. Anyway, I'm glad you enjoyed reading it.
~Crystia
Last edited by Indi at 2:08:40 PM EDT on April 8, 2009.
I never find it interesting to read popular books... They usually have standard plots... Like the authors wrote it so that everyone will like it... Mostly they'll have happy ending. Or I'll say : too good to be true. Just a boring story, with minimum twists...
As much as I enjoy the input, I can't quite agree with such a broad statement. The problem here isn't that it's popular, but that it's poorly written and the plot is full of contrived drama and holes big enough to drive a semi through.
However, there are other authors who are popular and are excellent writers. One that comes to mind is Terry Goodkind and his Sword of Truth series. He has excellent character development, the descriptions are clear and the plot is woven together nicely.
I guess I'm just saying popularity isn't a means to measure if a book is any good or not. There are books out there that are considered popular and definitely worth reading. =P Thanks for the input and taking the time to read it.
Madman With a Box (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/08/09 | Reply
Wow. I had an idea that Twilight stunk, but not to this horrendous degree... for four whole books! Proof that there is no real quality control in publishing.
I have an aunt who is LDS, so I'm familiar with the things you were talking about.
Angst is what sells these days. Not sex, but teenage kids who have such problems that they feel like the world is ending and no one cares about their feelings.
Raid Boss (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/08/09 | Reply
Great article. I can tell you really cut it down to be more concise. I can only imagine some of the stuff you wanted to say (as evident by the tone). I'm so confused though. Not because of your writing, just because even from the short summaries you gave the plot just seems so disconnected. You're right, that does sound like a terrible story. I have to stop getting the 14 year olds at camp to read it.
I don't know what's worse, seeing girls read that, or those terrible TTYL books.
Anyway, I have to say that I completely agree with you ^____^ I never find it interesting to read popular books... They usually have standard plots... Like the authors wrote it so that everyone will like it... Mostly they'll have happy ending. Or I'll say : too good to be true. Just a boring story, with minimum twists...
Acrocanis
Otakuite | Posted 09/10/10 | Reply
Two questions remain after reading this: How did you keep all your brain cells through the course of reading all that (or did you??? no offense to the Twilight fans, my friends among them, but it is rather difficult for the rest of us), and how long did it take before you went running to the nearest work of eloquence to wash the pain away?
Poyongluv
Senior Otaku+ | Posted 07/10/10 | Reply
I think its rediculous the way the book talks about there romance so much..It was rather sickening lol, and your right now that i think of it.. it never did have much details on what was going on. But I liked vampires before the book even came out, I think they are cool and I dont think people who hate twilight should hate vampires in general, because not all vampires are from the book.
Im starting to really hate the book since its making people write articles about how much the authors visions of vampires suck.
Markus wolfe
Grand Otaku | Posted 09/17/09 | Reply
@HametsuKuro:
So it's necrophilia AND a biting fetish?
Man, no matter I look at this, it just gets more and more messed up.
HametsuKuro
The Turning Tide (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 09/09/09 | Reply
@Markus wolfe:
Y'know, I never understood women's sexual fascination with vampires, especially with all those other monsters available. Werewolves are like primal beefcakes, wizards and warlocks can work wonders with their magic, and genies will grant your every wish. But vampires? They're basically intelligent, non-rotting zombies that want your blood instead of your brains. It's basically necrophilia.
I read in a mythology book about vampires that there is indeed a myth explaining why. They stated that "A vampire's bite is more pleasurable than sex itself." I am sure some other authors took advantage of that myth(including me).
ChibiSasuke
13th Angel (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 07/04/09 | Reply
Amen to this.
It's true, the whole story was becoming convenient, ESPECIALLY at the end. They all came for this "war", and guess what happens? NO WAR. Everything goes back to normal and everyone is happy.
I hated when Bella had no hardship to overcome from her transition from human to vampire. Bleh. It wasn't even worthy of "epic fail" at that point.
Bella's obsession is extremely ridiculous as you have already pointed out. Of course Edward will do anything to protect her. I mean, she's a complete idiot right? And so is he.
And then the imprinting... omg. I just wanted to claw my eyes out and burn the book right then. All for convenience, of course. This story was a complete fairy tale. A waste of time.
I've heard that the ending for the New Moon movie is supposed to be different from the book. Maybe something interesting will actually happen. But I doubt it. I doubt it.
Shadweh
Otaku Eternal | Posted 05/27/09 | Reply
First of all, thank you for this essay. Quite a few of my friends are die-hard fangirls over Edward and I never get a clear reason why from them, so this essay that you wrote gives me a better picture at what they're looking at. Now that I have a better understanding of "who" he is from the rebuttal, I can confidently say that they're raving over nothing. (Admittedly, I have no room to talk with how I fangirl over a few choice fictional characters, but at least I derive an intelligent reason for it after throughoully looking at their character AND I don't bother going to the trouble of worshipping those characters.)
Another reason why I thank you is because those same friends of mine have been bugging me to read thes series. My two main reasons for putting it off is because it's a vampire romance novel (which I feel heavy skeptisism towards because of how easily those stories turn into tales of pure lust *cough-cough-True Blood*) and because of the negative side of the fandom. No offense, you Twilight lovers out there, but the over-the-top obsession is creeping me out! Now that I've read your essay--which is the first intelligent negative view of the series that I've read, by the way--I don't feel as indecisive in my decision to not pick up the books altogether.
On a final note, I have to say that the whole concept of marriage being the pennacle of a woman's life and that she be submissive to her husband is rather out-dated by our culture's standards. Don't get me wrong, marriage and cooperation with your spouse is still highly encouraged, but in my opinion that shouldn't come without, as you put it, a balance between the two. (Please note that I don't have personal greviences against the LDS church. Truth be told, I don't know enough about the LDS church to have an opinion on it.)
Again, thank you. (*bows*)
emmisu
Otakuite+ | Posted 04/28/09 | Reply
The first two were an interesting read in my opinion, I thought the story was pretty okay, it occupied me for a while without losing my attention the first time around. But as I thought about it again recently, I've noticed even more prominence in the lack of dynamic characters. There's no depth to anyone, nobody changes, and the author put a nice little ribbon on the end to satisfy everyone so that they're happy.
Jacob doesn't fight for Bella, he protects the 'abomination' that not only goes against everything he stands for, but also must cause him great pains, Bella becomes perfect immediately, yadda yadda.
It was like gagging on dry grits after looking past the glittery surface into the matte stale white canvas below.
Lloyd Irving4
Otakuite+ | Posted 04/27/09 | Reply
Twilight is just one of the many examples that effort =/= sales... they have worked out that just about everyone thinks the same and they're using it to their advantage by using cliche's that are widely popular... they're not going to put effort into it because as soon as they do, they have a smaller audience... some wont like what extra effort was put in and some will. The bad thing about everyone liking similar things is everyone will be influenced by similar things, therefore ending up thinking the same things, losing our independence that makes humans, well humans. Twilight for example has increased the amount of vampire fans, now the majority are into vampires. And i could go on more about what else is influencing people to all think the same but it's off topic.
Kachikamac
Queen of Termina (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/26/09 | Reply
Your essay put a new perspective on this overhyped series. I CANNOT stand Twilight, and my friends and family are absolutely in love with it. I'm so glad other people think it sucks as bad as I do.
♥Kachi
Korey
Gambino (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/26/09 | Reply
@Markus wolfe:
It's a rounded figure, of course....
Markus wolfe
Grand Otaku | Posted 04/26/09 | Reply
@Korey:
Well, not necessarily below 60 IQ points....
Korey
Gambino (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/26/09 | Reply
@jeweloflife:
Nah, not even sex anymore. That is a niche market cornered to young adult males that are between the ages of 18-25 and possess an IQ of less than 60.
Gaijin otome
Otakuite++ | Posted 04/26/09 | Reply
@Markus wolfe:
haha! that just made my day!
Hmmmm. well, one character Alice has been known to freak out and play "dolly" with bella! I mean, they could all use the excuse, "well, uh...Alice went a little crazy with the glitter lotion this morning and now it's everywhere...i mean, everywhere."
^-^ arts and crafts...i'd like to cut up one of the books and turn it into paper dolls! or better yet, a paper child cringing in fear of the words that contain so many adjectives and the word "perfect" an infinite number of times.
jeweloflife
Afrofantastic (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/26/09 | Reply
@Korey:
Angst and sex...That is what truly sells.
Lizinator03
Otaku Legend | Posted 04/26/09 | Reply
OMFG O_O
....i love this....
AND I LOVE YOU!!
*not in the wrong way...lawl*i thought it was kinda cool how you kept really professional throughout the whole thing.
i dont care that it was lengthy, the way you wrote it made it flow easily so it didn't seem that long either way.
this essay just seriously made my day
Last edited by Lizinator03 at 7:42:42 AM EDT on April 26, 2009.
Hiashi Hyuga
Otakuite | Posted 04/26/09 | Reply
I Whole heartedly say, its a disgrace to literature and film making..its not great, its not good, it's just a poorly made waste of paper made of a crazy person. This is just a RUMOR but the author was said to have been hearing voices whilst writing them...
Markus wolfe
Grand Otaku | Posted 04/25/09 | Reply
@Gaijin otome:
Actually, sparkles are the art supplies equivalent of herpes.
They never go away...
Perhaps the vampires are victims of an arts and crafts camp gone wrong?
Last edited by Markus wolfe at 10:13:53 PM EDT on April 25, 2009.
Cherryshock
Sold my soul (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/25/09 | Reply
I love you so much right now.
I mean.
Every time I see the words 'lion and lamb'
I throw up a bit in my mouth.
Gaijin otome
Otakuite++ | Posted 04/25/09 | Reply
@Markus wolfe:
Exactly! If everything worked perfectly before, why did you have to go and take it apart to make some new craptraption?!?! However, Meyer thought that with one bite and a lil' bit of venom, everything works out fine! Wrong! For dracula, it took him a bite night for a month. For others in say, Anne Rice or Amelia Atwater-Rhodes, it took the blood exchange. There's a reason why there are myths and legends and why nobody tries to completely stab them throught the heart with a stake, drain out all of their blood, cut off their head, stuff its mouth full of garlic, dump it in broad-daylight, sprinkle holy water over it and dismember it, finally burning the pieces separately and scattering the ashes to the wind. (That should just about cover all the ways to kill a vampire) They've been thought out before a hundred million times, had editors with brains, and people actually believe them...or at least they used to.
Oh, and I must say one more thing: sparkles....I don't get it. Yeah, it's meant to be pretty, but I don't know how that was supposed to repulse Bella. maybe she would've thought "Oh my god, my boyfriend's gay?!" (i don't mean to offend anyone who's gay by trying to compare edward to you.) But no, she just stands there saying, "ooh, shiny!" Let's look at sparkles in a scientific way. How will sparkles help/hurt edward? First of all, he can be spotted easily if he steps into the sun: easy target, bam! fail. Secondly: who is going to run away from a sparkly guy? Not too many people. If it's supposed to be a warning mechanism like the colors of poison dart frogs, than it's a fail. So many people would just point and laugh instead of running. However, now that I think about it, maybe the sparkles are supposed to draw the weak-minded, shallow, ADD/ADHD victims (aka Bella) toward them and entrance them with their "perfect beauty" so they can pounce! But I highly doubt that's what Meyer was going for. She probably just wanted to make "perfect" edward even more "perfect" by making him pretty. A bad attempt at shojo sparkles perhaps? Personally, I'd laugh in his face and think that his scintillating skin just makes him even more of a wimp than he already is.
Wow, that was a rant. ^-^
Markus wolfe
Grand Otaku | Posted 04/25/09 | Reply
@Gaijin otome:
The problem with the idea that a vampire can turn you with 3 bites in a month or less is that the vampire population would grow ridiculously fast. That makes a one-bite turn policy an autofail.
If the lore ain't broken, don't fix it!
Indi
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/23/09 | Reply
@:
However, I must warn you, while it is interesting and informative, the essay is incredibly long.
I'm sure I can manage it. After all, this essay here, if I had attempted to cover everything, would have easily been twice as long. Seriously though, so long as it's interesting, long is not an issue, so if you remember the link, post it.
~Crystia
Gaijin otome
Otakuite++ | Posted 04/23/09 | Reply
@Markus wolfe:
I must say, I kinda agree with you here: that meyer totally disregarded all previous mythos and threw it out the window. I do like the idea that she tried (key word) to "freshen it up". However, she started adding too much crap that even she couldn't keep track of or develop. The one thing that REALLY ticks me off is the whole "one-bite turns you" theory. Even Dracula couldn't do that: it took a series of bites, usually about a month, of the vampire biting the prospective human. Another popular method is a sort of blood exchange: the vampire drinks the human's blood, and in turn the human drinks the vampire's. One major flaw in the whole one-bite thing is that if there are, idk, twenty or so vamps that we know of in the volturi (the "evil" group of vamps), and they've been around for hundreds of years: they either have to kill all of their prey or let them turn into vamps, which in turn could create even more vamps: Thereby creating a dcrease in the human population, i.e. food source, and eventually humans would be hunted into extinction and the vampires would die of starvation or turn to cannibalism. Meyer obviously didn't think this through. If a teeenager can point out the flaw in fifteen minutes and meyer (or her editor) can't even see what's wrong with it, or try to fix it, then that's knda pathetic. oh, and i must say that i found all of the characters flat and with no background, yes even edward and bella. we never really get to know anyone. like someone else said before: bella doesn't even know edward's favorite color! that's pathetic! btw, Markus Wolfe, i read your comments on some other essay Twilight: The Root of All Evil, and you pwn!
...i'm done now...^.^
Last edited by Gaijin otome at 8:04:17 PM EDT on April 24, 2009.
demoncupcake
Senior Otaku+ | Posted 04/23/09 | Reply
@:
I think that was the longest comment I ever read.
Markus wolfe
Grand Otaku | Posted 04/23/09 | Reply
@Indi:
Just got a look at Meyer's face on the link you posted.
Ew.
Indi
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/23/09 | Reply
@xmagentawhipdx:
And apparently Twilight is just a story that the author stole from her friend, and rewrote as an even worse version. which is why her ass is getting sued.
You do know that's a hoax right? Click Meh!
~Crystia
xmagentawhipdx
Senior Otaku | Posted 04/22/09 | Reply
So she was a mormon, hey??? And apparently Twilight is just a story that the author stole from her friend, and rewrote as an even worse version. which is why her ass is getting sued. Apparently. At any rate, I think that if the relationship between Edward and Bella was real it'd be just like the relationship an addict has to crack. Why? because it seems more destructive then anything else, this creepy co-dependency with some chick who has a morbid obsessession with a guy who wants to suck her blood/maim her. It's falling in love with a psychotic stalker who you know nothing about. A relationship like that in the real world wouldn't last. One of the reasons it's so stink. luff x
Indi
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/22/09 | Reply
@Markus wolfe:
But I will stand by my Hulk comparison. Werewolves equate to beserkers in combat, and would probably gobble up vampires on both sides. It would be a very dangerous alliance for the vampires involved, one that would only be taken as a final desperate defense.
Well I wasn't saying your analogy was wrong. I think we are both have the same point really, Meyer's execution or rather means of using it in the story was poorly done. That is the very heart of her failure in this series, using things and yet not bothering to give it any real depth.
It's just a convenient means for her to move the plot forward. If she wants to have the vampires and werewolves able to co exist like that, then she needs a much broader and more in-depth background for the mythos of both of them.
Or rather they need more than some stupid kid switching sides and able to handle it so easily. It was all too pat and easy for them to do what they did. So I think it's possible, but not how she did it.
I will also stand by my fourth statement. It is my understanding that there have been many changes in the symbolism of vampire's since Dracula was first published, but werewolf lore is relatively adamant.
I found it disappointing that she had a different mythos for the vampires and yet never did anything with it other than to move things along. The same with the werewolves. Also, if the lore has pretty much never changed, then surely it's a good reason to finally do so.
However, one thing I'm sure we can both firmly agree on, is that Meyer's is not the author to do it. She never went beyond superficial danger and change in her story, ever.
I love when authors take the time to switch things up instead of relying on what others before them have done. But not when they don't bother to actually make it believable. The series fails on so many levels that it's sad.
Anyway... At least we both agree that the books are a waste of time. =P
~Crystia
haseo luver92
Otaku Legend | Posted 04/22/09 | Reply
@Indi:
Thanks!! ^^ But now I feel really stupid cause I know the religion, but didn't recongnize the acronym. *facepalm* LOL
はせお
haseo luver92
Otaku Legend | Posted 04/22/09 | Reply
@Markus wolfe:
I AGREE FULLY! I don't hate vampires, but neither do I like them. It's more of...a "mweh" feeling from them. But I do hate cliches, and most vampire stories are filled with cliches.
(I am the only girl my age that thinks that way apparently, or at least, in my school, it's so frustrating!! ><)
はせお
Markus wolfe
Grand Otaku | Posted 04/22/09 | Reply
@Indi:
Sorry about that. Sometimes the testosterone gets to my head.
Yeah, most of my stuff was bigoted. But I will stand by my Hulk comparison. Werewolves equate to beserkers in combat, and would probably gobble up vampires on both sides. It would be a very dangerous alliance for the vampires involved, one that would only be taken as a final desperate defense.
I will also stand by my fourth statement. It is my understanding that there have been many changes in the symbolism of vampire's since Dracula was first published, but werewolf lore is relatively adamant.
Rachmaninoff
Otaku Legend | Posted 04/22/09 | Reply
I think this one sentence in your essay sums things up perfectly.
This isn’t a true love; this is a dysfunctional dance between two individuals who have never grown up.
I've heard similar sentiments from other people who have read the books and based on what you've written, it sounds terrible. The next time some of my other LDS friends try to get me to read them, I'm going to link them to this instead. I don't mind romance stories, but if they're as poorly done as this, no thanks.
Anyway, nice work with going into why you didn't like it. So much better than the usual 'it sucks' nonsense that I hear from others. And nice work with your comment responses too. =P
demoncupcake
Senior Otaku+ | Posted 04/21/09 | Reply
@Aaryanna:
:3 Okay.
Sorry if I wasted your time at all. I guess it was just a big, huge, misunderstanding.....
._.
Aaryanna
Otaku Legend | Posted 04/21/09 | Reply
@demoncupcake:
>__>
Oh....ehehe..
I'm sorry, again. I shouldn't have said that you'd been saying things about something that you didn't know about, and I'm sorry. That was really rude of me.
But you're right, I shouldn't take it personal. I guess I kind of took it the wrong way and I thought that the author was attacking the church as a whole (which I don't really know why, because they really weren't). That's another reason to apologize.
I wouldn't feel to bad. After all, you had no way of knowing that I used to be a member of that religion. That and text doesn't convey very well if someone is being serious or sarcastic. So I can see how my comment could be taken either way. So no worries. ^_^
~*Aaryanna*~
Indi
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/21/09 | Reply
@Markus wolfe:
I only have a few things to say in response to your comment and as a result, I’ll only be quoting a few spots since most of what you’ve got up isn’t relevant. Anyway, starting here:
First, werewolves teaming up with vampires to defeat a greater enemy is sort of like the Hulk being a member of the Avengers.
The point I was getting at was that it was contrived to drive the plot forward, not that such a thing would never happen. It’s all in the storytelling and execution really.
Second, imprinting? Seriously.
The concept of imprinting isn’t the issue; it was, again, the execution. I’m not here to mindlessly bash the author when she had some creative ideas to begin with. Also, don’t try and think you’re somehow better at it. Every author, including yourself and the one you’re bashing, has their reason or excuse for why it’s okay that they did things a certain way.
Which brings us to the third point of malcontent: the relationship of Bella and Edward. Open your mouth and say holy shit, perfect couple much?
Perfect couple? I’m thinking you completely missed my point. They were anything but perfect, unless you mean perfectly dysfunctional and obsessive. Real couples are supposed to balance each other out. Bella and Edward did not; they were too enmeshed in each other to be capable of doing so.
Fourth issue: That stupid bitch totally disregarded the ancient symbolism that is werewolves and vampires! One is the primal, instinctual side of humanity, the murderous beast that lives in the heart of every man, no matter how civilized. The other is vicious revenge from the grave, sucking humanity dry.
Now here’s where you’re just being absurd. If every vampire and werewolves mythos story out there was the same, there would be no point in reading them since it would be the same tired old story but with different names. The author may have written a poor romance novel, but she was anything but stupid.
And last....LDS religion? I don't know what that is, but I DON'T like the sound of it.
Google is your friend, hell I even provided a link in one of the comments here. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints This article is not a bash on this religion, but merely showing how I think the author allowed it to influence her writing style. To even attempt to judge an entire religion based on one author, would be the very height of arrogance and stupidity.
So seriously, try to be more objective and less biased in your observations.
~Crystia
Last edited by Indi at 6:07:20 PM EDT on April 21, 2009.
Allamorph
Spiritus Memorae (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/21/09 | Reply
@Markus wolfe:
Your manner of speech utterly robs you of any credibility you might have otherwise had. Regardless of whether or not you and I agree on taste, you have just provided a clear and resounding example of why there is a bitter feud over this series.
Markus wolfe
Grand Otaku | Posted 04/21/09 | Reply
@haseo luver92:
Y'know, I never understood women's sexual fascination with vampires, especially with all those other monsters available. Werewolves are like primal beefcakes, wizards and warlocks can work wonders with their magic, and genies will grant your every wish. But vampires? They're basically intelligent, non-rotting zombies that want your blood instead of your brains. It's basically necrophilia.
Markus wolfe
Grand Otaku | Posted 04/21/09 | Reply
First, werewolves teaming up with vampires to defeat a greater enemy is sort of like the Hulk being a member of the Avengers: It's great when he's pounding the enemy to paste, but he'll probably turn on you when he's finished.
Second, imprinting? Seriously. I admit to using it in a fanfic once, but that was Kiba Inuzuka imprinting on a very sexy lady, and that happens in real life. Their love will not be realized by some shitty "Can't bear to be apart." Notion (Kiba DOES spend 2 or so years at without seeing her, or her seeing him, and, although they do miss each other, they get along just fine) NO! I would prefer to sum it up as "Life and all it's joys are way better when you can share them with someone else, and that someone else is you, babe." Sure, he almost commits a double suicide with her, but that's more too do with guilt for killing the woman he promised to never hurt. (Considering that Kiba's morals rely heavily on his loyalty, this is quite realistic)
Which brings us to the third point of malcontent: the relationship of Bella and Edward. Open your mouth and say holy shit, perfect couple much? Not only are they the perfect couple, but they redefine perfect couple. See, I have 2 definitions of a perfect couple:
A) The conflicting attributes, personalities and abilities of the individual members of a couple cancel out (or at least temper) the negative aspects of the couple, and combine so that they are greater than the sum of their abilities. I like to think of this as Kagome and Inuyasha's relationship: His raw destructive and physical powers compensate for Kagome's....human....ness....while she can keep Inuyasha's anger in check and use spiritual abilities.
B)A couple with no major potential issues.
See, these two were custom made for each other by the author, so..... yeah.
Fourth issue: That stupid bitch totally disregarded the ancient symbolism that is werewolves and vampires! One is the primal, instinctual side of humanity, the murderous beast that lives in the heart of every man, no matter how civilized. The other is vicious revenge from the grave, sucking humanity dry.
And last....LDS religion? I don't know what that is, but I DON'T like the sound of it.
demoncupcake
Senior Otaku+ | Posted 04/20/09 | Reply
@Aaryanna:
>__>
Oh....ehehe..
I'm sorry, again. I shouldn't have said that you'd been saying things about something that you didn't know about, and I'm sorry. That was really rude of me.
But you're right, I shouldn't take it personal. I guess I kind of took it the wrong way and I thought that the author was attacking the church as a whole (which I don't really know why, because they really weren't). That's another reason to apologize.
.__.
And thanks to SunfallE for fixing my comment. It kinda freaked me out when the entire first half was gone. O__o
I feel like a huge loser right about now.
QueenKittychan
Senior Otaku+ | Posted 04/20/09 | Reply
Aaaahhh...it's nice ot find other people who dislike the series Twilight. Though I have never read the book (no force in the world can make me) my friends' feed backs on it makes me want to burn every book in that series when I see it. In my opinion, the book wrecks the image of a vampire. How does Bella get pregnant because of Edward if he's DEAD?!
I love this essay! I finally have something to throw at my friends when they say that I should read this book before I say that I hate it.
Indi
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/20/09 | Reply
@haseo luver92:
But I do have one question, what exactly is LDS? I know you've said it was a religion, but I honestly have no fathomable idea what you're talking about. If you could explain a little bit that would be great in understanding your essay even more.
It's a little more politically correct term for what is commonly known as the Mormon religion. You can read up on it here at Wiki: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints It would take too long for me to go into depth on it.
Very well written and your points were explained fantastically. Very persuasive, but as someone said, maybe try to cut it down a page. But other than that great, like I said, you even have me re evaluating the book!
I'm glad you enjoyed it. I think it was me who talked about cutting it down since I did do that. If I had included everything I could talk about and had taken the time to go into depth with the comparisons, it could have easily been twice as long. So I went through and trimmed it down for clarity's sake instead. lol
Anyway, thanks for the response. I appreciate it.
~Crystia
haseo luver92
Otaku Legend | Posted 04/20/09 | Reply
First I'll say that I'm a casual fan of the series, but, reading your essay has got me thinking about the story and it's story.
But your ananlysis about Bella is spot on as well as Edward. Personally I thought they were both too overly clingy, Edward too protective and Bella too whiny, and the ending horribly cliche (as you've stated already).
I think there has always been a fasination with vampires, honestly, I don't understand why, but there has. Most girls now a days lust for something that is seemingly wrong but right, the "in love with a vampire" fits that ticket and fulfils that.
What bothers me just is more of the crazy fans who seem to have taken the story a bit too far. Some girl almost punched me for saying I didn't like Edward! It's become almost a cult following for the story!
But I do have one question, what exactly is LDS? I know you've said it was a religion, but I honestly have no fathomable idea what you're talking about. If you could explain a little bit that would be great in understanding your essay even more.
Very well written and your points were explained fantastically. Very persuasive, but as someone said, maybe try to cut it down a page. But other than that great, like I said, you even have me re evaluating the book!
はせお
Indi
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/20/09 | Reply
@:
New Moon on the other hand ....
So now I wonder, did you read beyond the first page? Because I covered all of the series (including New Moon) and wrapped things up on page five with my final thoughts.
~Crystia
Markus wolfe
Grand Otaku | Posted 04/20/09 | Reply
Auto-favorited for dissing Twilight. Will read later.
DragonRider11
Otaku Eternal | Posted 04/20/09 | Reply
I'm afraid I must agree, I've read them all, and kept thinking to myself, "Is he nuts? All he's ever done is stalk her, or try not to eat her, She doesn't even know what his favorite color is! where is all this devotion coming from?" While it is interesting at first, it is far two drawn out, and all the character seem copy-pasted together. And of course, the icing on the cake, the movie, was 5 times as pathetic.
And we wonder why our girls think they can do as they please and it won't matter! ><
Thanks for FINALLY providing a realstic, non-bashing, objective opinion. It was incredably refreshing.
TheDarkAngel
Pathetic Diabetic (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/20/09 | Reply
AH man, I totally agree with what you say and everything you mean! It was just an awful series dripping with angst and blind love, meant to capture the typical person's interest and give them the christmas present they knew they'd get. *sigh* It was quite predictable, ne?
Even sadder... Meyer's rewriting the first book from Edward's perspective... Yeah, Stephanie, just keep kicking that dead horse...
+~*Yosei*~+
And, then... I met you.
anime obsessed
Senior Otaku | Posted 04/20/09 | Reply
I really enjoyed your views on this series. I never noticed how much the LDS religion played a part in this series.
SunfallE
Nyaa~ (ZE MEANIE) | Posted 04/19/09 | Reply
@Allamorph:
I've always been able to edit or delete any comment on the site. o_O In this case, an unclosed tag makes IE users unable to respond, so fixing it is kind of necessary. All I did was add three / in the appropriate spots. =P It's really no different than you being able to edit posts at OB you know. *pokes you*
In the name of the tune I will punish you!
Allamorph
Spiritus Memorae (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/19/09 | Reply
@SunfallE:
The simple fact that you can do that makes me rather nervous.
SunfallE
Nyaa~ (ZE MEANIE) | Posted 04/19/09 | Reply
@demoncupcake:
I went ahead and fixed the italics tags since that can make it difficult for other people when it comes to being able to comment. Just so you know, you left three of them unclosed.
In the name of the tune I will punish you!
Aaryanna
Otaku Legend | Posted 04/19/09 | Reply
@demoncupcake:
Um, do you have to be that harsh about it?
I read all the books-and I got really tired of them-and I know that Meyer is a member of the LDS church. I am as well, and I think that was a rather...insensitive thing to say about our religion. I am
definitely not defending Meyer in any way, but...I think it's rude to say something like that about a church so large just because one author wrote a book series and she happens to be LDS.
Even if that one author's book series happened to really suck.
I was referring to the sentiments and comparisons that were brought up in this article (not the LDS church as a whole) and yes I'm going to be that harsh about it. I'll clarify why in a moment here since it pertains to the other part of your comment here:
:3 I hope I don't come off really rude or anything. Your comment just really offended me, and I thought I should tell you that, even if I never talk to you again. It seemed like you were making a sudden stamement about someone because of their religion, or something like that. That you were making a statement about a church that you haven't been going to your whole life...If that makes sense at all.
Again, I apologize if I have offended you in any way or if I have taken your comment the wrong way and/or misunderstood it. I just felt that I should explain something. :3
See here's the thing. I'm 16 and I was born and raised in the LDS church. I didn't stop going until shortly before I turned 14. So I'm not some outsider who isn't familiar with it. I've been a part of it just as long as you were. So moving to this part here:
I'm thirteen, fourteen in August. But I ask that nobody use it against me when I say I've been going to the LDS church my whole life and say that "It's only thirteen years," because that's probably thirteen years more than you have. :3 Thank you.
Based on my previous clarification, I can make the same claim in terms of years/experience since nearly 14 years out of 16 is pretty close to my entire life. But the real point is that, like the article, it is my opinion and nothing more. I wouldn't take it personal, seriously.
Oh and you might want to edit your comment. You forgot to close an italics tag so it's messing up the rest of the comments. o_O
~*Aaryanna*~
EDIT: One other thing, if it wasn't clear, some of my tone in my original comment was me being sarcastic. Just so you know.
Last edited by Aaryanna at 9:56:20 PM EDT on April 19, 2009.
demoncupcake
Senior Otaku+ | Posted 04/19/09 | Reply
@Aaryanna:
*shoots the LDS church*
O_____o
Um, do you have to be that harsh about it?
I read all the books-and I got really tired of them-and I know that Meyer is a member of the LDS church. I am as well, and I think that was a rather...insensitive thing to say about our religion. I am
definitely not defending Meyer in any way, but...I think it's rude to say something like that about a church so large just because one author wrote a book series and she happens to be LDS.
Even if that one author's book series happened to really suck.
:3 I hope I don't come off really rude or anything. Your comment just really offended me, and I thought I should tell you that, even if I never talk to you again. It seemed like you were making a sudden stamement about someone because of their religion, or something like that. That you were making a statement about a church that you haven't been going to your whole life...If that makes sense at all.
Again, I apologize if I have offended you in any way or if I have taken your comment the wrong way and/or misunderstood it. I just felt that I should explain something. :3
As for the article, I agree with the parts that do not judge Meyer's writing for her religion and that talk about the actual text. You did a really good job describing why you do not like Twilight and why you think that the author did a bad (for lack of a better word) job on writing it. (:
Also...for anybody that was wondering?
I'm thirteen, fourteen in August. But I ask that nobody use it against me when I say I've been going to the LDS church my whole life and say that "It's only thirteen years," because that's probably thirteen years more than you have. :3 Thank you.
Last edited by SunfallE at 10:41:22 PM EDT on April 19, 2009.
Nathan
Good Old Reliable | Posted 04/15/09 | Reply
That honestly sounds terrible. I had no interest in reading it before and I certainly have none now. It's a pity that popularity doesn't mean something is actually any good.
Indi
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/14/09 | Reply
@:
Your comparisons to the LDS religion are so accurate. It's kind of disgusting. -_- Most of my friends who are active LDS members love the book because it fits so well with their religious beliefs. As for me, I'm not a fan of vampire stories in general so I rather liked the changes made to the myths but like you pointed out, none of that was actually developed or used well unless it was convenient to the plot. And for me the author never developed the most interesting characters in the series. I felt the second book was just a waste and didn't add anything to the series at all.
Yeah, I can see that. I have friends who are and they sing praises of this series. I can see the potential in the story, but that's about it. Also, I find it highly ironic that people bash the areas where the author had creativity and yet did little to develop it. Instead of following the standard mythos, she branched off and tried to do something else. It's just a pity that she never bothered to actually develop any of that.
For me the stupidest thing was in the fourth book where Bella gets pregnant,is physically struggling and it was Jacob, the werewolf, not Carlisle, the vampire and medical doctor for hundreds of years, who first thinks that Bella's baby needs blood for both of them to survive. It was such an obvious answer to the problem and yet not one of the vampires thought of it or considered blood as being the solution to Bella being so sick. It was so stupid and seemed like just another way inject Jacob in the storyline.
Not only was that utterly stupid, I found the aspect about how their bodies come to a halt being tossed aside painfully stupid as well. Because if you think about it, really think about how the author portrayed this story then you have to come to the following conclusion:
There's no way Edward could have gotten her pregnant, his body would have come to a halt too, including producing the sperm necessary to even get her pregnant to begin with. That's another one of the author's convenient loopholes that she used to create drama.
So although there were aspects of the storyline of the series that I did like, the author just never went anywhere with it. I think you summed the series up rather well.
On that we are both agreed. It's kind of sad to see someone have a potentially good idea and yet completely ruin it in the execution.
~Crystia
Indi
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/14/09 | Reply
@Clyne Lacus:
I think what makes me reluctant to read Twilight in the very first place is its genre >___< happily-ever-after romance isn't my thing...
I can understand that, it's not my thing either. Other things lead to me reading this, otherwise, I would not have bothered. Heh.
~Crystia
Aaryanna
Otaku Legend | Posted 04/11/09 | Reply
You're right about the comparison's. We exist to grow up and have babies!
*shoots the LDS church*
I don't regret leaving that behind. That kind of mindset is just BLECH. I don't plan on reading this anytime soon. I don't like romance anyway. And this sounds horrible, especially the fourth book. Ugh. =_=
~*Aaryanna*~
Selene Shri
Grand Otaku | Posted 04/10/09 | Reply
o_o You weren't kidding when you said you were going to go into detail about it. As much as I like the series, I do like that you took the time to say why you didn't like it. I get so tired of the people who just say it sucks and don't bother to say why they think it does.
We don't agree, but that's okay.
I just wish everyone would be more polite about it like you were. I hope that makes sense. ^^
~Sarah
Sabrina
Otaku Archangel | Posted 04/10/09 | Reply
I've seen the movie since one of my friends like this series. o_O I wasn't very impressed with the movie so I never bothered to pick up the book to read. Based on the summaries you given... It sounds like something I wouldn't care for.
Also, I cannot deny the sentiment that marriage is considered more important than other things in the LDS religion. ^^ However, not everyone thinks total subservience is acceptable. Though sadly, some do and you are actually looked down on if you don't agree.
I'm already getting a certain amount of 'what's wrong with you' from people since I'm going to be 24 and I'm in college, and not married yet. =_= I kind of find that a bit offensive since I think life should be balanced instead of centered on just one thing.
Then there's always the deal that to a certain extent, when you do or don't get married is no one else's business. Anyway, it was an interesting read and if anything, it only confirms my decision to never bother to read the books.
-Sabrina
Clyne Lacus
Otaku Eternal | Posted 04/09/09 | Reply
@Indi:
I mean, popular books which make those who aren't into reading before want to read those books =3 well, I have to admit that some popular books are also great ^___^
I think what makes me reluctant to read Twilight in the very first place is its genre >___< happily-ever-after romance isn't my thing... (exceptions for Gone with the Wind and Scarlett, they're amazing =3). And when I watched the movie, the plot seems really boring...=3
Anyway, that's just my thoughts... (plus, writing lots of sentences like this can help me improve my English XD)
And you're welcome! ^___^
Best wishes,
♥~Clyne~♥
TimeChaser
Madman With a Box (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/08/09 | Reply
@Indi:
Yeah. I remember having a conversation with one of my cousins, and she talked about the pressure she felt that she was expected to find a nice missionary boy to marry. ._.
Bazinga!
Indi
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/08/09 | Reply
@:
But yeah...good of you to read the steamer and give a good thought on it. You have my kudos -- I couldn't make it through book one.
Definitely don't bother or attempt to ever finish it. If not for that challenge, I would have stopped at book one. It was too damn boring.
Now I hope and pray you don't get attacked by fangirls...
Well since I did flag this for publication (at the urging of others) I'm kind of hoping I do get some fun responses to play with. =3
~Crystia
Indi
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/08/09 | Reply
@Shinmaru:
lol, I just put off writing my World post to read this the whole way through. I hope you're happy!!
I am, very much so. =3
~Crystia
Indi
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/08/09 | Reply
@TimeChaser:
I have an aunt who is LDS, so I'm familiar with the things you were talking about.
Oh good, someone who understands what I was getting at. If you're at all familiar with it, then it's easier to see what I was getting at. It's a pity so few people will actually get that aspect. Or they'll be offended by the obvious implications from it.
~Crystia
Indi
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/08/09 | Reply
@Korey:
Don't I know it. It totally fits the OMG U DON'T UNDERSTAND ME mentality that's so prevalent these days. The author tries to pretend otherwise, but it's pretty damn clear in the series. And probably another reason why it's so popular... The kids are OMG I KNOW HOW THEY FEEL! *headesk*
~Crystia
Indi
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/08/09 | Reply
@red tigress:
I'm so confused though. Not because of your writing, just because even from the short summaries you gave the plot just seems so disconnected.
I'm not surprised, the story was too predictable so there was no real plot beyond them ending up together. I left some things out, because like you said, I was trying to keep it concise. I hit 3,700+ words and yet it could have easily been twice that length.
The author spent way too much time inserting contrived drama instead of giving them a real reason to love one another. Even with the stuff I left out, it's still pretty bland and boring as hell.
I wouldn't recommend reading it to see what I didn't cover though. Anyway, I'm glad you enjoyed reading it.
~Crystia
Last edited by Indi at 2:08:40 PM EDT on April 8, 2009.
Indi
Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/08/09 | Reply
@Clyne Lacus:
I never find it interesting to read popular books... They usually have standard plots... Like the authors wrote it so that everyone will like it... Mostly they'll have happy ending. Or I'll say : too good to be true. Just a boring story, with minimum twists...
As much as I enjoy the input, I can't quite agree with such a broad statement. The problem here isn't that it's popular, but that it's poorly written and the plot is full of contrived drama and holes big enough to drive a semi through.
However, there are other authors who are popular and are excellent writers. One that comes to mind is Terry Goodkind and his Sword of Truth series. He has excellent character development, the descriptions are clear and the plot is woven together nicely.
I guess I'm just saying popularity isn't a means to measure if a book is any good or not. There are books out there that are considered popular and definitely worth reading. =P Thanks for the input and taking the time to read it.
~Crystia
Shinmaru
Baron of Terribad (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/08/09 | Reply
lol, I just put off writing my World post to read this the whole way through. I hope you're happy!!
Haha, seriously, though, I enjoyed reading this, although I have zero experience with the Twilight books.
Love thy Evangelion.
TimeChaser
Madman With a Box (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/08/09 | Reply
Wow. I had an idea that Twilight stunk, but not to this horrendous degree... for four whole books! Proof that there is no real quality control in publishing.
I have an aunt who is LDS, so I'm familiar with the things you were talking about.
Bazinga!
Korey
Gambino (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/08/09 | Reply
I hope you’re ready for some serious angst]
Angst is what sells these days. Not sex, but teenage kids who have such problems that they feel like the world is ending and no one cares about their feelings.
Allamorph
Spiritus Memorae (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/08/09 | Reply
Most, if not all, of the other vampires were just as flat and about as appealing as a stale cracker.
Beautiful.
red tigress
Raid Boss (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 04/08/09 | Reply
Great article. I can tell you really cut it down to be more concise. I can only imagine some of the stuff you wanted to say (as evident by the tone). I'm so confused though. Not because of your writing, just because even from the short summaries you gave the plot just seems so disconnected. You're right, that does sound like a terrible story. I have to stop getting the 14 year olds at camp to read it.
I don't know what's worse, seeing girls read that, or those terrible TTYL books.
Thanks for the essay! Twas a good read.
Clyne Lacus
Otaku Eternal | Posted 04/08/09 | Reply
Phew, what a lenghty essay =3
Anyway, I have to say that I completely agree with you ^____^ I never find it interesting to read popular books... They usually have standard plots... Like the authors wrote it so that everyone will like it... Mostly they'll have happy ending. Or I'll say : too good to be true. Just a boring story, with minimum twists...
Oh, and I think you wrote this well ^___^
Best wishes,
♥~Clyne~♥