I knoq I am far from even being good, with the bad quality images sometimes, over sized textures, and bad renders. But as im sure you know, i am really trying hard to get better, it's just right now there is nothing I can do to even imrporve cause I have no program to. I someday I want to be gooe enough for MT though I wouldn't post there O.O but just to be able to feel my work is good enough.
Can I be someone else for all the times I hate myself?
Thank you very much for this post, I didn't even read any tutorials on making good wallpapers and decided to go on with my taste. Looks like I'm wrong and now I realised where my weaknesses are. Also I am kinda rushing in making wallpapers. (pardon my English, I'm drowsy xD;)
But I do admit when I first submitted my wallpaper, I was only filling my free time and I did not have any skills in walling at all. So the rest of them that I submitted were to improve my skills, but I don't know if I have been improving in walling since it's hardly to find people who would give in their two cents to amateurs.
P/S: Just to tell you I don't really like Lizzie too xD lol
Last edited by ReiKiba at 1:48:10 PM CST on December 25, 2010.
I'd have to agree with you, so you're not being hinh and mighty. In my case, flaming would be regarded as a comment which slams the wall unnecessarily.
Last edited by CrimsonANBU at 6:12:57 AM CST on November 28, 2010.
Ehm.. textures? Dunno how to explain, the design/picture you add over the wall and set it to a certain Blend Mode (overlay, color burn etc)
I prefer soft critiques, don't want to sound high and mighty, but on my works there's no need for hardcore, bone cutting critique. Those would be flaming in my case, not critiques.
Well I should say that's a mercy... of sorts? I prefer straightforward critique, 'no frills, no need to worry about my feelings' types. Much easier to see what I need to improve. What sort of critique do you prefer?
Thanks a lot! I've not been getting much help on how to improve, so that was a good boost~ :3 Though if I might be so rude... what textures? ._.?
I know that world, I wanted to give some advice, but there some things posted there that required too much mercy to not slice up, so to speak, so I decided to be kind and not say anything.
Your walls are beautiful, but most have quality issues or extraction ones. The quality is usually due to the texture you add, it lowers the lineart quality, makes them jagged.
Your Alice wall can make it <3 And I think your Shuuhei one as well: Alice Shuuhei
Sorry if you feel like I'm butting in, but there's this world of people called 'Critiquers United' (it's run by vacuumology) People there really do want to improve, so perhaps you could give some critique there?
Also, can you please do me a favor? Be brutally honest about this. Would my walls make it onto MT or not? I'd like to know, because I've submitted one or two, and all I've gotten are comments ranging from 'Wow, sick.' to 'Cool.' :< Don't worry about my feelings, just be honest.
"These are the Minitokyo and Animepaper standards, they are high, well designed, and for those with no will to improve, impossible to follow!"
Very true.
@Fran: That's true, I loved visiting MT because there was so much I could learn from the walls there - I think it's what determined me to start walling, I wanted to get into the gallery 8D And when I did, I felt like the most awesome thing on Earth, even though my works were crap compared to what I do now.
Yeah, and MT was more strict and stuff. Now it's more easy-going, encouraging people to submit and all. Too much democracy D:< Lol.
True, I miss the old mods (the ones that have retired). I almost feel like there's no one left except for Sheqel and the Elites :|
@Saku: Hell yeah, blur it to Sunday and back! 8D I need to experiment with the filters more (haven't even used all of them yet!)
File -> Save For Web. It's recommended even though it's funky at times.
And of course others don't give a rat's ass. They're too lazy to. I actually know where they're coming from on this one, sadly D:
Last edited by sweetdevil at 1:24:31 PM CST on November 17, 2010.
Lol, because every time you post about MT is to rant about the staff :< and I always feel so "D:" about it, I do agree that the gallery was being neglected during some months but we're (or more, I am) working to mantain the quality standards up to what MT deserves. :3
I think that the problem with quality (at AP&MT) is not only due to a "lack of moderation" or "lower standards" but a lack of will of the new wallers to make decent crap. I have discussed this not only with the rest of the mods at MT but with fellow wallers and we have noticed that the walls submitted in the past months are highly uncreative and poorly made.
Which is quite odd since nowadays is easy get resources of a nice quality (lots of .pngs, huge textures and patterns, brushes, etc) and not only that, vectoring and painting are now common walling techniques so it's pretty much unforgivable to submit stuff that fails in the quality of the resources.
My humble opinion is that this new generation of wallers don't understand that walling takes time and devotion, at least to make it in more serious way. Because I mean, you can make your own collages and stick in on your desktop but please don't submit them on places that have walling requirements.
Having mentioned the resources stuff, I think it's only mandatory for wallers to spend time on arranging a proper composition as well.
Walling is an art and you need to work to make something worthy.
Pande, you and I come from a generation of wallers that was UBER competitive, we have to admit that things were harder at that time so it's normal that now we felt kinda disappointed at the walls that are being submitted now. It's hard to maintain a constant quality for walls, since it depends on factors that are always changing: the moderators and the wallers.
Regarding Marissa, I have mixed feelings towards the way she handle moderation, she was a super dedicated mod but in my opinion, a mod should be someone approachable and I remember that when I was a regular member and had something to ask I knew I wasn't going to ask her, lol.
I liked Saikusa better, she was a nice combo of kick-ass and uber nice <3
Hm, what a helpful post.
Though I'm never going to try to submit in MT, at least not for a very very long time, I appreciate this post a lot, it inspires me even more to improve. I'm always looking for ways to better my work, and I know I have a long way to go before I'm worthy of posting at MT! I noticed that all of the works there are quite impressive, and I actually love that they have such high expectations, so there's not just a bunch of junk you'd have no interest in seeing there.
I never use the magic wand for extractions. I used to, probably....a year ago I did because I felt my own extractions looked sloppy. But now I have a lot of patience and I use my eraser tool. I don't have Photoshop, only PSP, an old version, so the pen tool doesn't exist on my program. But with the eraser, I just go along the outlines of my image and I think it does a decent enough of a job, though I know they could improve. I plan on downloading GIMP tonight or tomorrow, so hopefully I can improve with some more advance programs.
I try my very best to use the best quality of images I can. Admittedly, there are walls of mine that have low quality images because I resized them too much, as you state NOT to do. I have stopped making them larger, and have just worked around the size of the images. Instead of trying to always make my walls 1600x1200, I find the size that suits best for the original size of the image, though sometimes I DO have to make them smaller, I never make them bigger anymore. And I rarely use brushes now, but I don't like resizing those either.
Most of the textures I use are in fact very large, so I do make them smaller :3
Needless to say, this was in fact a very helpful post, and I hope it can help me improve because I am always trying to become a better wallpaper-maker. I'm not content with my skills now, so I am working at getting better, and you're a huge inspiration for me to do so.
Haha, the only way for me to make a change is to go at night and implant a small information chip in the brain of the amateurs, with no will to improve people on theO. For me walling is a hobby, so I put heart in it and I want it to be perfect, but for others it's just a way to make 20 minutes pass, so I can't really change much XD
Yeah, Marissa retired over 1 year ago D': And there was another cool mod who retired, Spike, he could beat any troll on the forum XD
You lost me at the Save for Web advice, but I do remember hearing about it at one point, so I guess it works then. Haha, I used to abuse blur as well, I blurred everything, even if there was no need. Bg quality sucks? Blur it. Crappy extraction? Blur it. Messed colors? Blur them XD It was a PS policy for me. Till I discovered the Diffuse Glow filter XDDDD I still abuse it sometimes even now XD
If I were to actually speak what's on my mind when commenting on some things, then I'd be the most hated user on theO. I often ignore slight quality issues, and heck even extraction ones, I used to rant them, but it was meaningless even if the author cheerfully replied 'omg, I'm so tatally happy for the advice and I'll use it for sure'. Bull. Rarely people actually give 2 cents.
Haha, I can't make this a Fan Word, so no faving >n<
Inded, I don't care if the wall took 1 year, if it looks crappy, then it is, and is therefore deleted. And it's a fishy situation, I really don't understand how can someone spend hours on a render (found) with a brush background? D: Even when I was a noob I spent hours on more awesome stuff, like my [Flame of the Sakura] one, with the sexy guy in the sunset XDDD
Loool, what did you think this would be about? Encouraging people to submit there? XDDDDDDD
LOL You might as well been speaking Chinese! :> I had no freaking clue what any of that wallpaper lingo means. Ah, it's good to be ignorant on a subject sometimes. But nice argument. I know shit about walls but even I can see the quality differences. Just keep doing your job Saku, you're the resident wall authority as far as I know. Maybe you can make a change here when it comes to quality. Who knows.
Uh, I'd hate it if MT became a dump for ugly stuff, though it's becoming more and more obvious it's headed in that direction. I miss the days when you had to really work on your stuff to get into the gallery; seems AP has (way) lower standards nowadays as well.
Amen! I got bored of preaching the same old stuff too. I really tried to give a hand, but you can't do it when the other party isn't listening ._.
Extraction: you forgot to mention those that use the Blur Tool to blur the artifacts around the crappy extraction. God knows, I used to do it too back in my n00b days *shudders*
Hints for saving: you can use Save For Web and stuff still looks decent at around 70 quality, but obviously you'd have to up the setting to 90 for mostly red images. Strange thing though: I've noticed that in some cases, Save As gives a smaller file size than SFW, and at a higher quality too (SFW~70 = SA~90).
Ghosting: I think people do this because they see official video game wallpapers that use this norm. Subsequently, they think it's OK to pull the same crap. And you don't add text, you add the blown-up series logo because it looks moar spiffeh and speshul :P
MT needs more mods like Marissa was D: I believe she retired, didn't she?
AWESOME JOB WITH THE ARTICLE. Make sure to show it on your portfolio if you haven't!
Last edited by sweetdevil at 9:07:43 AM CST on November 15, 2010.
Amen to this.
Thanks a lot for posting this guide, at first I read the title world and I was like "uh-oh..." but and I'm glad it turned out to be this. <3
Well, yes, you pretty much nailed the reasons why stuff gets deleted and yup, quality is my top 1 reason to delete walls. Is not enough to make something look good, you have to make sure the quality of all the resources used is decent, meaning no enlarging, no blurring, no overfiltering, no overtexturing.
Something interesting is also the time spent on walls, people sometimes use it as an argument on why it's wall should stay the on gallery. Time is relative, it's not a synonym for quality :|.
Not sure if you know, but I consider you this site's Marissa. Marissa was (she retired ;A;) in my opinion the best MT mod. She was tough, took a lot of flaming, but did her job flawlessly without according second chances to puppy eyes. I was a big fan of hers <3
So if you were to go to MT as a mod, I'm sure you'd be perfect for all the wusses there XD
That's the main reason I go to AP for, the scans are amazing, I think I'm ranked as well, which is awesome but weird since I rarely submit XD AP has the highest standards of them all, there I'm sure to get perfect critiques which is great, I did learn a few useful tips from there <3
And indeed, I think we can both agree on the laziest theO person since we both witnessed the theory >D
Right, see I won’t disagree that people can do a decent job if they keep looking for ways to improve how they extract. Nor will I argue that some are too lazy to put effort in. I just know that plenty of people do even if the results aren’t the best.
As for your theory that’s one I’ve seen plenty of times. Those are the people I consider to be rather lazy. They’re more interested in making the front page than in making a decent wallpaper.
As for thinking the quality applies to all sites… lawl, good lord no. I consider theOtaku an alternative, not a place to be considered similar to places like MT or AnimePaper. I may not do much at MT but I did at one time become a community scanner for AnimePaper. I certainly didn’t get that by being lazy about the quality of scanning required.
Anyone who thinks the sites are the same isn’t paying attention and deserves to have their works deleted. It’s fine if you do less here since that’s how we roll, but if I was a moderator for either of the other sites, you can bet I’d be a hell of a lot more strict.
I used to extract with the Polygonal Lasso Tool before using the Pen Tool. It's a bit harder with the curves, but the extraction is very clean. I'm not sure if that's a tool PS comes with, but there are ways of making beautiful extractions, most people are honestly just lazy to do so.
Besides, unless they use Paint, I'm sure most people here already have PS or GIMP or Sai and whatnot, so it's just the problem of improving. I don't force anyone to not use Paint and spend cash on PS, but I advise those who do have PS to use it more wisely and patiently (hence my tips).
And to be honest I have this theory which I sort of tested, that wallers who are popular are content with their level just because no matter what they do reaches the top. So they spam daily with 3 walls which look almost the same, have the same mistakes, layout and so on.
I'm not really against the quality passing marks on here, I just don't like it when people think they apply to all sites.
I wrote this article after stalking a GB conversation on MT between 2 theO members who decided to post there. They even said the mods on MT are rude for deleting their badly extracted walls, which really ticked me off. This article may sound angry, but it does so because that's what I felt then. I was very upset that people think theO standards apply everywhere and they think there's no need to improve as long as they're high and mighty here. Fun while walling is good, but if they want to make it to MT they need to stress themselves a bit as well.
The only beef I have with the cry to get better is people tend to forget that photoshop isn't free. They also forget that not every version comes with the tools you're telling them to use. For example, my version of photoshop doesn't have the pentool so telling me to use that to do extractions is a total waste of time. I'd love to test it out sometime but spending the money for a better program isn't a priority.
However it doesn't mean I don't want to improve. Just look at my previous crap compared to my newest one. I try to get better with what I do have at my fingertips. And I make a point of deleting an older one every time I put something else up. I figure one of these days all of those poor examples will finally vanish from my gallery. lol
The other thing I don't get is the heavy criticism people have towards our more lax requirements here. Anyone who wants better knows to go elsewhere for it and we give those who aren't interested in learning much more, or simply can't afford to, a place to post stuff they had fun making. After all I'm certainly not going to advocate pirating software just so someone can have the pentool.
I kind of see it as harmless really. I'd love for our place to have better stuff but at the same time I enjoy seeing people have fun.
If you notice plagiarized walls here, please report, me & Mariskah are the iron hammers when it comes to plagiarizing, no forgiveness.
Indeed, this site is all quantity over quality, post 3 crappy walls a day and you're the first in the Our Artist's category. That's the mechanism. But since I can't possibly think of anything better, I don't really rant much about it XD
Spiffy made a good comment though, lately MT comments are 2 word spams D: I get at most 10-15 good comments from a batch of 45+. But it's still a way cooler place XDDD
I completely agree.
I posted some of my walls on here for fun or contests, but I think I'm done with that. Besides the fact that this site just seems to be a popularity contest, I get a lot more comments and feedback on MT. And since there are quality standards, I prefer to go there (or animepaper) to search for wallpapers to use for my own computer. Probably most important to me, plagiarism is throughly dealt with there. I see a lot of wallpapers here that are just someone else's but resized or that use fanart they found on photobucket. But that's just my two cents.
Yup, I'm a Backspace person XD Maybe because I play games and I often need it for stuff XD;;
It happens so very often, the student knowing more than the teacher D: It's almost annoying at a point. Blending can be done by duplicating the layer and using some Blur on the original, it'll glow a bit underneath, just enough for the image to not look alienated from the bg. Give her this tip from your net buddy :D
Using Pen Tool you just trace the area you want to cut, connect to the starting point to end the tracing, right click and choose 'Make Selection'. Then you switch to the Lasso Tool or Marquee Tool, either works just fine, and press Backspace to delete the selected area. No complicated mask thingies or anything XD
It's super easy and never leaves ugly margins, plus it's perfect for the curves >w<
Lol, but why would they teach kids an ugly method of editing D:
I sort of grew up with MT, maybe that's why I had an abrupt improvement from placing elements to vectoring ^^; Boy, I had so much spare time, it was awesome =u=
I like MT's ranking system, elites and highlights are awesome, here on theO is the 'quantity over quality' principle DX Doesn't matter the quality, if you spam with fugly stuff, you reach the top >__>#
Last edited by SakuraDust at 2:45:14 PM CST on November 14, 2010.
MT scares me half to death whenever I post! My last wallpaper got into the elite gallery though so I'm feeling better about the site. I post there to get some more constructive criticism but it seems like most of what I get now are spammers with one word comments. :/
OMG the first extraction method you talked about bugs me SO MUCH. Especially when that's what they're teaching the kids to do in my computer graphics class. It killed me Saku, IT KILLED ME! SMUDGING THE EDGES DOESN'T MAKE SOMETHING LOOK LIKE IT'S PART OF THE BACKGROUND.
I'm curious about how you use the pen tool though. Do you mask or do you make the traced area a selection and delete it? OR DO YOU DO SOMETHING ELSE THAT'S SUPER MYSTERIOUS?
Wonderful tips on wallies, even if I don't post on MT. ^^ It's pretty hard for me to improve my wallpapers because I have no idea of all the wallpaper-ing terms and such (vectoring, rendering, brushes... wha? @.@), and my photoshop trial ran out a long time ago. *sigh* If I ever do get photoshop again, or a program I can understand more than GIMP, I will follow these tips and hope to improve my wallpapers!
Also forgot to add that I love the fact that you say what you liked and didn't like on a piece- it helps me get better and know what is good to other people and what isn't. :3
I wouldn't have enough confidence to post my stuff on MT. xD
What bugs me the most on here is when people take an image, and horribly just randomly mess around with contrast and brightness and don't do anything else. Especially because randomly changing contrast and brightness simply does not look good.
I went on MT especially to improve my works... XD After one year here, I decided to go a step higher :S
Someway it works and I'm starting to know what I can post there or not... I saw others on TheO there and some (like me I guess) got a lot of their walls deleted. I hope everyone see that place as a place where we can (finally) do better... Except you and some on TheOtaku, people don't (or can't ?) give constructive comments so it was the time to move where I could find more killing comments 8D (Masochist ? Noooot at all :))
Anyway !! Thanks a lot for all your advices ^w^
I'm pretty new at photoshop (I realized I had it on my computer just a few months ago, silly me -__-) so it'll help^^
Vivianlove
Ooh La La (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 07/07/11 | Reply
Thanks Sakura, this post helps out alot. Thank you so much for posting this.
-Be Confident-
winterlionheart
Grand Otaku | Posted 04/11/11 | Reply
I knoq I am far from even being good, with the bad quality images sometimes, over sized textures, and bad renders. But as im sure you know, i am really trying hard to get better, it's just right now there is nothing I can do to even imrporve cause I have no program to. I someday I want to be gooe enough for MT though I wouldn't post there O.O but just to be able to feel my work is good enough.
Can I be someone else for all the times I hate myself?
ReiKiba
Otaku Legend | Posted 12/25/10 | Reply
Thank you very much for this post, I didn't even read any tutorials on making good wallpapers and decided to go on with my taste. Looks like I'm wrong and now I realised where my weaknesses are. Also I am kinda rushing in making wallpapers. (pardon my English, I'm drowsy xD;)
But I do admit when I first submitted my wallpaper, I was only filling my free time and I did not have any skills in walling at all. So the rest of them that I submitted were to improve my skills, but I don't know if I have been improving in walling since it's hardly to find people who would give in their two cents to amateurs.
P/S: Just to tell you I don't really like Lizzie too xD lol
Last edited by ReiKiba at 1:48:10 PM CST on December 25, 2010.
smoking crimson
Sunrise (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/28/10 | Reply
@SakuraDust:
Ahh, I get it. Thanks!
I'd have to agree with you, so you're not being hinh and mighty. In my case, flaming would be regarded as a comment which slams the wall unnecessarily.
Last edited by CrimsonANBU at 6:12:57 AM CST on November 28, 2010.
Mighty RED RANGER
SakuraDust
Moderator | Posted 11/28/10 | Reply
@smoking crimson:
Ehm.. textures? Dunno how to explain, the design/picture you add over the wall and set it to a certain Blend Mode (overlay, color burn etc)
I prefer soft critiques, don't want to sound high and mighty, but on my works there's no need for hardcore, bone cutting critique. Those would be flaming in my case, not critiques.
smoking crimson
Sunrise (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/28/10 | Reply
@SakuraDust:
Well I should say that's a mercy... of sorts? I prefer straightforward critique, 'no frills, no need to worry about my feelings' types. Much easier to see what I need to improve. What sort of critique do you prefer?
Thanks a lot! I've not been getting much help on how to improve, so that was a good boost~ :3 Though if I might be so rude... what textures? ._.?
Mighty RED RANGER
SakuraDust
Moderator | Posted 11/27/10 | Reply
@smoking crimson:
I know that world, I wanted to give some advice, but there some things posted there that required too much mercy to not slice up, so to speak, so I decided to be kind and not say anything.
Your walls are beautiful, but most have quality issues or extraction ones. The quality is usually due to the texture you add, it lowers the lineart quality, makes them jagged.
Your Alice wall can make it <3 And I think your Shuuhei one as well:
Alice
Shuuhei
smoking crimson
Sunrise (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/26/10 | Reply
Sorry if you feel like I'm butting in, but there's this world of people called 'Critiquers United' (it's run by vacuumology) People there really do want to improve, so perhaps you could give some critique there?
Also, can you please do me a favor? Be brutally honest about this. Would my walls make it onto MT or not? I'd like to know, because I've submitted one or two, and all I've gotten are comments ranging from 'Wow, sick.' to 'Cool.' :< Don't worry about my feelings, just be honest.
"These are the Minitokyo and Animepaper standards, they are high, well designed, and for those with no will to improve, impossible to follow!"
Very true.
Mighty RED RANGER
sweetdevil
Embracing Insanity (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/10 | Reply
@MFran:
@Fran: That's true, I loved visiting MT because there was so much I could learn from the walls there - I think it's what determined me to start walling, I wanted to get into the gallery 8D And when I did, I felt like the most awesome thing on Earth, even though my works were crap compared to what I do now.
Yeah, and MT was more strict and stuff. Now it's more easy-going, encouraging people to submit and all. Too much democracy D:< Lol.
True, I miss the old mods (the ones that have retired). I almost feel like there's no one left except for Sheqel and the Elites :|
@Saku: Hell yeah, blur it to Sunday and back! 8D I need to experiment with the filters more (haven't even used all of them yet!)
File -> Save For Web. It's recommended even though it's funky at times.
And of course others don't give a rat's ass. They're too lazy to. I actually know where they're coming from on this one, sadly D:
Last edited by sweetdevil at 1:24:31 PM CST on November 17, 2010.
MFran
~*FABULOUS MAX*~ (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/15/10 | Reply
@SakuraDust:
Lol, because every time you post about MT is to rant about the staff :< and I always feel so "D:" about it, I do agree that the gallery was being neglected during some months but we're (or more, I am) working to mantain the quality standards up to what MT deserves. :3
I think that the problem with quality (at AP&MT) is not only due to a "lack of moderation" or "lower standards" but a lack of will of the new wallers to make decent crap. I have discussed this not only with the rest of the mods at MT but with fellow wallers and we have noticed that the walls submitted in the past months are highly uncreative and poorly made.
Which is quite odd since nowadays is easy get resources of a nice quality (lots of .pngs, huge textures and patterns, brushes, etc) and not only that, vectoring and painting are now common walling techniques so it's pretty much unforgivable to submit stuff that fails in the quality of the resources.
My humble opinion is that this new generation of wallers don't understand that walling takes time and devotion, at least to make it in more serious way. Because I mean, you can make your own collages and stick in on your desktop but please don't submit them on places that have walling requirements.
Having mentioned the resources stuff, I think it's only mandatory for wallers to spend time on arranging a proper composition as well.
Walling is an art and you need to work to make something worthy.
Pande, you and I come from a generation of wallers that was UBER competitive, we have to admit that things were harder at that time so it's normal that now we felt kinda disappointed at the walls that are being submitted now. It's hard to maintain a constant quality for walls, since it depends on factors that are always changing: the moderators and the wallers.
Regarding Marissa, I have mixed feelings towards the way she handle moderation, she was a super dedicated mod but in my opinion, a mod should be someone approachable and I remember that when I was a regular member and had something to ask I knew I wasn't going to ask her, lol.
I liked Saikusa better, she was a nice combo of kick-ass and uber nice <3
/long ass comment ftw.
Morbid Dollie
Strawberry (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/15/10 | Reply
Hm, what a helpful post.
Though I'm never going to try to submit in MT, at least not for a very very long time, I appreciate this post a lot, it inspires me even more to improve. I'm always looking for ways to better my work, and I know I have a long way to go before I'm worthy of posting at MT! I noticed that all of the works there are quite impressive, and I actually love that they have such high expectations, so there's not just a bunch of junk you'd have no interest in seeing there.
I never use the magic wand for extractions. I used to, probably....a year ago I did because I felt my own extractions looked sloppy. But now I have a lot of patience and I use my eraser tool. I don't have Photoshop, only PSP, an old version, so the pen tool doesn't exist on my program. But with the eraser, I just go along the outlines of my image and I think it does a decent enough of a job, though I know they could improve. I plan on downloading GIMP tonight or tomorrow, so hopefully I can improve with some more advance programs.
I try my very best to use the best quality of images I can. Admittedly, there are walls of mine that have low quality images because I resized them too much, as you state NOT to do. I have stopped making them larger, and have just worked around the size of the images. Instead of trying to always make my walls 1600x1200, I find the size that suits best for the original size of the image, though sometimes I DO have to make them smaller, I never make them bigger anymore. And I rarely use brushes now, but I don't like resizing those either.
Most of the textures I use are in fact very large, so I do make them smaller :3
Needless to say, this was in fact a very helpful post, and I hope it can help me improve because I am always trying to become a better wallpaper-maker. I'm not content with my skills now, so I am working at getting better, and you're a huge inspiration for me to do so.
Thank you :3
-those with the biggest hearts hurt the most
SakuraDust
Moderator | Posted 11/15/10 | Reply
@Knowmad:
Haha, the only way for me to make a change is to go at night and implant a small information chip in the brain of the amateurs, with no will to improve people on theO. For me walling is a hobby, so I put heart in it and I want it to be perfect, but for others it's just a way to make 20 minutes pass, so I can't really change much XD
SakuraDust
Moderator | Posted 11/15/10 | Reply
@sweetdevil:
Yeah, Marissa retired over 1 year ago D': And there was another cool mod who retired, Spike, he could beat any troll on the forum XD
You lost me at the Save for Web advice, but I do remember hearing about it at one point, so I guess it works then. Haha, I used to abuse blur as well, I blurred everything, even if there was no need. Bg quality sucks? Blur it. Crappy extraction? Blur it. Messed colors? Blur them XD It was a PS policy for me. Till I discovered the Diffuse Glow filter XDDDD I still abuse it sometimes even now XD
If I were to actually speak what's on my mind when commenting on some things, then I'd be the most hated user on theO. I often ignore slight quality issues, and heck even extraction ones, I used to rant them, but it was meaningless even if the author cheerfully replied 'omg, I'm so tatally happy for the advice and I'll use it for sure'. Bull. Rarely people actually give 2 cents.
SakuraDust
Moderator | Posted 11/15/10 | Reply
@MFran:
Haha, I can't make this a Fan Word, so no faving >n<
Inded, I don't care if the wall took 1 year, if it looks crappy, then it is, and is therefore deleted. And it's a fishy situation, I really don't understand how can someone spend hours on a render (found) with a brush background? D: Even when I was a noob I spent hours on more awesome stuff, like my [Flame of the Sakura] one, with the sexy guy in the sunset XDDD
Loool, what did you think this would be about? Encouraging people to submit there? XDDDDDDD
Knowmad
Scarecrow (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/15/10 | Reply
LOL You might as well been speaking Chinese! :> I had no freaking clue what any of that wallpaper lingo means. Ah, it's good to be ignorant on a subject sometimes. But nice argument. I know shit about walls but even I can see the quality differences. Just keep doing your job Saku, you're the resident wall authority as far as I know. Maybe you can make a change here when it comes to quality. Who knows.
sweetdevil
Embracing Insanity (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/15/10 | Reply
Uh, I'd hate it if MT became a dump for ugly stuff, though it's becoming more and more obvious it's headed in that direction. I miss the days when you had to really work on your stuff to get into the gallery; seems AP has (way) lower standards nowadays as well.
Amen! I got bored of preaching the same old stuff too. I really tried to give a hand, but you can't do it when the other party isn't listening ._.
Extraction: you forgot to mention those that use the Blur Tool to blur the artifacts around the crappy extraction. God knows, I used to do it too back in my n00b days *shudders*
Hints for saving: you can use Save For Web and stuff still looks decent at around 70 quality, but obviously you'd have to up the setting to 90 for mostly red images. Strange thing though: I've noticed that in some cases, Save As gives a smaller file size than SFW, and at a higher quality too (SFW~70 = SA~90).
Ghosting: I think people do this because they see official video game wallpapers that use this norm. Subsequently, they think it's OK to pull the same crap. And you don't add text, you add the blown-up series logo because it looks moar spiffeh and speshul :P
MT needs more mods like Marissa was D: I believe she retired, didn't she?
AWESOME JOB WITH THE ARTICLE. Make sure to show it on your portfolio if you haven't!
Last edited by sweetdevil at 9:07:43 AM CST on November 15, 2010.
MFran
~*FABULOUS MAX*~ (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/15/10 | Reply
Lol, can I fav this post or something?
MFran
~*FABULOUS MAX*~ (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/15/10 | Reply
Amen to this.
Thanks a lot for posting this guide, at first I read the title world and I was like "uh-oh..." but and I'm glad it turned out to be this. <3
Well, yes, you pretty much nailed the reasons why stuff gets deleted and yup, quality is my top 1 reason to delete walls. Is not enough to make something look good, you have to make sure the quality of all the resources used is decent, meaning no enlarging, no blurring, no overfiltering, no overtexturing.
Something interesting is also the time spent on walls, people sometimes use it as an argument on why it's wall should stay the on gallery. Time is relative, it's not a synonym for quality :|.
SakuraDust
Moderator | Posted 11/15/10 | Reply
@SunfallE:
Not sure if you know, but I consider you this site's Marissa. Marissa was (she retired ;A;) in my opinion the best MT mod. She was tough, took a lot of flaming, but did her job flawlessly without according second chances to puppy eyes. I was a big fan of hers <3
So if you were to go to MT as a mod, I'm sure you'd be perfect for all the wusses there XD
That's the main reason I go to AP for, the scans are amazing, I think I'm ranked as well, which is awesome but weird since I rarely submit XD AP has the highest standards of them all, there I'm sure to get perfect critiques which is great, I did learn a few useful tips from there <3
And indeed, I think we can both agree on the laziest theO person since we both witnessed the theory >D
SunfallE
Nyaa~ (ZE MEANIE) | Posted 11/15/10 | Reply
@SakuraDust:
Right, see I won’t disagree that people can do a decent job if they keep looking for ways to improve how they extract. Nor will I argue that some are too lazy to put effort in. I just know that plenty of people do even if the results aren’t the best.
As for your theory that’s one I’ve seen plenty of times. Those are the people I consider to be rather lazy. They’re more interested in making the front page than in making a decent wallpaper.
As for thinking the quality applies to all sites… lawl, good lord no. I consider theOtaku an alternative, not a place to be considered similar to places like MT or AnimePaper. I may not do much at MT but I did at one time become a community scanner for AnimePaper. I certainly didn’t get that by being lazy about the quality of scanning required.
Anyone who thinks the sites are the same isn’t paying attention and deserves to have their works deleted. It’s fine if you do less here since that’s how we roll, but if I was a moderator for either of the other sites, you can bet I’d be a hell of a lot more strict.
In the name of the tune I will punish you!
SakuraDust
Moderator | Posted 11/15/10 | Reply
@SunfallE:
I used to extract with the Polygonal Lasso Tool before using the Pen Tool. It's a bit harder with the curves, but the extraction is very clean. I'm not sure if that's a tool PS comes with, but there are ways of making beautiful extractions, most people are honestly just lazy to do so.
Besides, unless they use Paint, I'm sure most people here already have PS or GIMP or Sai and whatnot, so it's just the problem of improving. I don't force anyone to not use Paint and spend cash on PS, but I advise those who do have PS to use it more wisely and patiently (hence my tips).
And to be honest I have this theory which I sort of tested, that wallers who are popular are content with their level just because no matter what they do reaches the top. So they spam daily with 3 walls which look almost the same, have the same mistakes, layout and so on.
I'm not really against the quality passing marks on here, I just don't like it when people think they apply to all sites.
I wrote this article after stalking a GB conversation on MT between 2 theO members who decided to post there. They even said the mods on MT are rude for deleting their badly extracted walls, which really ticked me off. This article may sound angry, but it does so because that's what I felt then. I was very upset that people think theO standards apply everywhere and they think there's no need to improve as long as they're high and mighty here. Fun while walling is good, but if they want to make it to MT they need to stress themselves a bit as well.
SunfallE
Nyaa~ (ZE MEANIE) | Posted 11/15/10 | Reply
The only beef I have with the cry to get better is people tend to forget that photoshop isn't free. They also forget that not every version comes with the tools you're telling them to use. For example, my version of photoshop doesn't have the pentool so telling me to use that to do extractions is a total waste of time. I'd love to test it out sometime but spending the money for a better program isn't a priority.
However it doesn't mean I don't want to improve. Just look at my previous crap compared to my newest one. I try to get better with what I do have at my fingertips. And I make a point of deleting an older one every time I put something else up. I figure one of these days all of those poor examples will finally vanish from my gallery. lol
The other thing I don't get is the heavy criticism people have towards our more lax requirements here. Anyone who wants better knows to go elsewhere for it and we give those who aren't interested in learning much more, or simply can't afford to, a place to post stuff they had fun making. After all I'm certainly not going to advocate pirating software just so someone can have the pentool.
I kind of see it as harmless really. I'd love for our place to have better stuff but at the same time I enjoy seeing people have fun.
In the name of the tune I will punish you!
SakuraDust
Moderator | Posted 11/15/10 | Reply
@Phantom Kai:
If you notice plagiarized walls here, please report, me & Mariskah are the iron hammers when it comes to plagiarizing, no forgiveness.
Indeed, this site is all quantity over quality, post 3 crappy walls a day and you're the first in the Our Artist's category. That's the mechanism. But since I can't possibly think of anything better, I don't really rant much about it XD
Spiffy made a good comment though, lately MT comments are 2 word spams D: I get at most 10-15 good comments from a batch of 45+. But it's still a way cooler place XDDD
Phantom Kai
Otakuite+ | Posted 11/14/10 | Reply
I completely agree.
I posted some of my walls on here for fun or contests, but I think I'm done with that. Besides the fact that this site just seems to be a popularity contest, I get a lot more comments and feedback on MT. And since there are quality standards, I prefer to go there (or animepaper) to search for wallpapers to use for my own computer. Probably most important to me, plagiarism is throughly dealt with there. I see a lot of wallpapers here that are just someone else's but resized or that use fanart they found on photobucket. But that's just my two cents.
Kaerlyn
Tea pixie (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/14/10 | Reply
Good points there. I KNOW i'm not good enough for MT ^^'
*sob* my version of PS is old and doesn't have the pen tool...
SakuraDust
Moderator | Posted 11/14/10 | Reply
@SpiffySporkPerson:
Yup, I'm a Backspace person XD Maybe because I play games and I often need it for stuff XD;;
It happens so very often, the student knowing more than the teacher D: It's almost annoying at a point. Blending can be done by duplicating the layer and using some Blur on the original, it'll glow a bit underneath, just enough for the image to not look alienated from the bg. Give her this tip from your net buddy :D
SpiffySporkPerson
Otaku Eternal | Posted 11/14/10 | Reply
@SakuraDust:
Thanks for sharing! Yay for simplicity. I think after you make the area a selection you can just press Delete on the keyboard too.
honestly I knew more than my teacher:/SakuraDust
Moderator | Posted 11/14/10 | Reply
@SpiffySporkPerson:
Using Pen Tool you just trace the area you want to cut, connect to the starting point to end the tracing, right click and choose 'Make Selection'. Then you switch to the Lasso Tool or Marquee Tool, either works just fine, and press Backspace to delete the selected area. No complicated mask thingies or anything XD
It's super easy and never leaves ugly margins, plus it's perfect for the curves >w<
Lol, but why would they teach kids an ugly method of editing D:
I sort of grew up with MT, maybe that's why I had an abrupt improvement from placing elements to vectoring ^^; Boy, I had so much spare time, it was awesome =u=
I like MT's ranking system, elites and highlights are awesome, here on theO is the 'quantity over quality' principle DX Doesn't matter the quality, if you spam with fugly stuff, you reach the top >__>#
Last edited by SakuraDust at 2:45:14 PM CST on November 14, 2010.
SpiffySporkPerson
Otaku Eternal | Posted 11/14/10 | Reply
MT scares me half to death whenever I post! My last wallpaper got into the elite gallery though so I'm feeling better about the site. I post there to get some more constructive criticism but it seems like most of what I get now are spammers with one word comments. :/
OMG the first extraction method you talked about bugs me SO MUCH. Especially when that's what they're teaching the kids to do in my computer graphics class. It killed me Saku, IT KILLED ME! SMUDGING THE EDGES DOESN'T MAKE SOMETHING LOOK LIKE IT'S PART OF THE BACKGROUND.
I'm curious about how you use the pen tool though. Do you mask or do you make the traced area a selection and delete it? OR DO YOU DO SOMETHING ELSE THAT'S SUPER MYSTERIOUS?
Tokyo iris
Otakuite++ | Posted 11/14/10 | Reply
I wouldn't dream of posting on MT at the moment, but I'll definitely use those tutorials. I really want to get better at wallpaper making!
Hulaberry32
Primadonna (Otaku Legend) | Posted 11/14/10 | Reply
Wonderful tips on wallies, even if I don't post on MT. ^^ It's pretty hard for me to improve my wallpapers because I have no idea of all the wallpaper-ing terms and such (vectoring, rendering, brushes... wha? @.@), and my photoshop trial ran out a long time ago. *sigh* If I ever do get photoshop again, or a program I can understand more than GIMP, I will follow these tips and hope to improve my wallpapers!
scoodi
Grand Otaku | Posted 11/14/10 | Reply
Also forgot to add that I love the fact that you say what you liked and didn't like on a piece- it helps me get better and know what is good to other people and what isn't. :3
scoodi
Grand Otaku | Posted 11/14/10 | Reply
I wouldn't have enough confidence to post my stuff on MT. xD
What bugs me the most on here is when people take an image, and horribly just randomly mess around with contrast and brightness and don't do anything else. Especially because randomly changing contrast and brightness simply does not look good.
Felcie
Unicorn Lover (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/14/10 | Reply
I went on MT especially to improve my works... XD After one year here, I decided to go a step higher :S
Someway it works and I'm starting to know what I can post there or not... I saw others on TheO there and some (like me I guess) got a lot of their walls deleted. I hope everyone see that place as a place where we can (finally) do better... Except you and some on TheOtaku, people don't (or can't ?) give constructive comments so it was the time to move where I could find more killing comments 8D (Masochist ? Noooot at all :))
Anyway !! Thanks a lot for all your advices ^w^
I'm pretty new at photoshop (I realized I had it on my computer just a few months ago, silly me -__-) so it'll help^^