@SunfallE:

Yup that does. Thank you very much and I am sorry for all the grief you have gotten, truly I am. Thanks again for clearing that up!

@Team Plasma N:

It's only harassment when the person has asked you to refrain from hugging them, among other things. The phrase itself isn't bad, it's that they were using them, in addition to hugging, after the member asked them to not do that kind of stuff.

That's when something moves from just goofing around into sexual harassment, when the other party clearly asks them to not do it and they do anyway.

Think about it, how would you feel if someone kept hugging you or doing things even if you politely said stop? That's why we have laws in regards to this kind of behavior, since some people lack the maturity to respect such a request.

I hope that clears it up for you.

I will not comment on this situation because I believe you have gone through enough and I don't need to put my two cents in. But I had a question since you brought it up, you had mentioned that calling someone 'babe' could be found as a form of sexual harassment which I think I understand. I guess I get confuse because there are so many things that could be considered that so this is what I am asking, if you are calling someone lets just say 'hon,' 'sweetie,' or even 'dear' for endearment can that be the same as babe? Even if I call girl friends this and they don't mind it? I mean I don't see a problem with it but I guess I want to know where I stand with you guys.

I said it was over, any more comments that are nothing but insults will be deleted from now on.

I meant it when I said it's over.

@SunfallE:

I find myself in a conundrum. I do not wish to reveal something that may have been said to be a lie because it was wanted to be kept secret. Hmm. But I will say, also with your response to smexykag in mind, that you are false in assuming that it was lies without reasoning behind it. Unless avarice blatantly stated it a lie and then I would not say anything else on the subject without first inquiring of avarice, but if NOT then it wasn't smart without consulting avarice.

Though, unfortunately I think her personality seems to be the real issue here, she is not one to be pushed around but is also blunt and playful, she never intends to hurt people. Ever. She is simply strong minded who strives very hard to make good friends. I find it unfortunate that whenever she talks about things in chats with friends or others, people become angry at her and it turns into these situations where she's confused and others think she's been purposefully cruel. I don't chat often, so perhaps it's far stricter than I would think, but I still find this state of affairs and its outcome baffling.

Also, I would like to see the entire conversation if that’s possible; otherwise I am simply lost on how no one but those who are friends of avarice can see that she was being attacked while trying to remain calm and playful? I think many of us in that bracket are irritated because things were most certainly overlooked and ignored. I just want to get the facts straight. If a friend of yours was unfairly accused of something wouldn't you try and help them? Find out what really happened? That's all we are doing--we being the few defending her it would seem. I would also like to say, I appreciate your candor in the matter and especially in responding to those with problems with your choice. It's very helpful and I appreciate it.

Thanks again.

@:

What does pretending to be a gay guy have to do with this? Do you even know anything about AvariceTears to tell whether or not this is a lie. No, I don't think you do.

I was right there in the room in stealth mode since I was verifying if there was any truth to the claims that they were harassing someone. So yes I do know that they were lying to the others.

And it seems like you're ignoring how EVERYONE is attacking each other. Avarice "hugs" hostclub's friend. Hostclub calls Avarice a jerk. That wouldn't make anyone feel good wouldn't it? Ahaha, I don't think so.

Like I said, I was right there, so that doesn't hold any water either.

I've gotta tell you, I've seen a helluva lot worse than this, moddy-moderator.
Either post the whole conversation, because this short piece doesn't do anything at all, or make a better argument to justify your actions because because this is a really lame argument. Thank you.

What's lame is thinking people aren't accountable for their actions. Because they are. If you are going to deliberately troll/bait/sexually harass someone for personal entertainment, you will be held accountable for it. Plain and simple.

after reading up to page 3, i can only say that i strongly agree with itsumademo. she wrote what i have to say about this situation better than i could ever have. and from your reply to her. yea it just confirms that there was no point in commenting when you had already made you verdict.

Lessons Learned:
be a prude and not dorky friendly to some one whos a grouch on chat...better yet *mental note* stay away from chat completely.

now ima get off this convo before i get banned for having an opinion haha *skips off to go draw* X3

@itsumademo:

Did you even read their comments in their blog post where they admitted they shouldn't create or stir controversies? A hug is unwanted if someone has previously asked them to NOT do it. Nor is it wanted when you're pretending to be a GAY guy. At the time they were sharing this paticular image: Picture and claiming it was them.

There is no misunderstanding, I watched this entire incident unfold with my own eyes. If they were sincere they wouldn't have been pretending to be a gay guy in the first place. =/

It's simple, no member should have to put up with that kind of childish behavior, not even as a joke. This type of thing is what got them banned before so they knew better.

As I continue to gain understanding on this situation, I find it to be more and more misconstrued every second.

First and foremost, when i read this section of chat, I find that host is the attacker. When avarice begins with a friendly hug and then joke by going to hug the same friend host did (a hug which was NOT unwanted and then given, the hug was itself meant as a hello) host seems to jump into defensive mode for no reason in saying:
"otakuhostclub: lets get something straight
otakuhostclub: keep to your crap and leave me and my business alone
otakuhostclub: got it"
This seems rude and abrupt. Perhaps they disliked the way avarice greeted, then they can merely request not to be, but instead they lash out in a way ANYONE would be confused and upset about.

Second, it appears to me, as I would hope it to anyone--though my hopes are slim-- that avarice is confused and trying to figure out what the problem is by approaching it in a still friendly, sarcastic manner, trying not to make this a blow out for NO REASON, as there isn't one. Kitten also tries vehemently to do this throughout the section.

Third, "babe" is being used just as sweetie, honey, dear, etc. would be used. As a friendly term. It's being used as a term of endearment or friendship, she is one, just being herself and two, trying to keep the other member calm despite how she has attacked her. As is the "time of the month" phrase being used. It's meant to calm people, it's meant as a joke. If it annoyed them, ask them not to use that phrase. It is simple.

If there is more to this conversation that helps to either groups defensive it should be posted as well, otherwise this short bit will illicit annoyance on either side. I'm shocked at how no one else has commented on the utter irrationality of host's emotions and comments here. It's clear and rude, and could and should have been handled in a completely different way. Whether avarice truly offended them or not. Everyone is left lost and confused on how anyone offended host, especially enough to immediately attack another without reason. If ANYTHING avarice deserved an explanation. This post section does NOT add credence to anything that's trying to be explained in the last blog section; in fact it only confuses the situation.

Four, which adds to every bit so far, this, is not a work environment. This is a site for people to post their work and greet to people, so as to make new friends. FRIENDS. Not co-workers, no bosses, nothing of work should be mentioned here as an excuse. That, to me, appears as a poor attempt to show that each situation is warranted. Hugging people, using terms of endearment, joking, it's all a part of what happens among people in chats. If someone doesn't like it, they should find somewhere else to go. This is not sexual harassment; this isn't even harassment ...at least not from avarice. If anything it's HOST harassing AVARICE.

I simply don't see how it's fair for avarice to be permanently banned. Her old site is a thing of the past, she was ALLOWED to create this new one and nothing has happened since that time. Now suddenly someone has a grudge against her and avarice's attempts at keeping that person calm and trying to discover the reasoning behind it are now harassment. If the situation goes beyond this, then to me it seems that avarice simply needed to be in her own room with the people she was with. And if she WAS then it's the fault of those who chose to stay and try to change things then simply leaving and letting avarice and her friends talk amongst themselves.

Somehow I hope this situation is resolved. I want fairness on all parts, and I just don't see that here. I would appreciate it if someone looking into this further, a person shouldn't be banned for this, especially considering how much worse others who have been banned have been.

Thanks.

Well this is a very difficult situation. I was not there, nor do I know Avarice personally, but I do know people who know her. I don't know what went on before other people entered the room, but it sounds like she was confused as why people were mad at her, and maybe took the humor a bit too far, but I don't see why that's the issue its become. About her being permanantely banned, as it says on the next post...wasn't she ALLOWED to make a new account after the first one? That's the impression I was under and if that's wrong I am sorry.

Like I said, I don't know exactly what happened, but there's my two cents.

I like using the role reversal method when it comes to these sorts of situations. I think the Golden Rule is best when dealing with people in chat. So, as a teaching method (which is quite dangerous at times, because it might illicit a negative response), I tend to recriprocate the behaviors back at the party who started them. Shoe's on the other foot sorta deal.

But yeah, let's have a bit of dignity, ya?

So many things wrong with that deal, from the attempt to force that topic on others when something like that is better suited to a counselor instead of a chat room, to the you must be pmsing...

Gotta love immature teenagers who have yet to grow up. [/sarcasm]

~Crystia

lolz
-Ryu

DAAAAAANG! Actually, I've seen several members do this before. It's ridiculous. And the "must be your time of the month" remark has always been something that has gotten under my skin. :/ I'm a woman, I'm having a bad day, that MUST be what's wrong. Anyways, I say good call on this one. They were just being rude.

As with most drama, I find this a combination of amusing, sad, and annoying.

But eh, people have different levels of maturity, and some haven't reached a very high level of it yet, so you can't particularly blame them for being where we all were once.

Though you CAN blame them for doing these things in chat, and being disrespectful about it.

Thanks for all your continuing hard work Beth.

Why am I amused by the fact that Mikey,who happens to be a self-proclaimed 'host' of "TheO Host Club"(which some members came up with :P) was the one being picked on? :p
Irrelevant to the matter but amusing nevertheless...

Well,matter taken care of...
Go shepherds! ;)

Yeah, forcing yourself on people (however you choose to interpret that) is generally a bad thing.