Well, welcome to the site and anime in general then!
Thank you. ^_^
Have you read the Long Tail by Chris Anderson
Funny you should mention that… I’m actually reading it right now. XD It is a rather interesting read.
Also, it seems I need to clarify my comment about iTunes… I didn’t explain that right. I use places like Amazon more than anything, for the actual purchase. Sorry if that created any confusion. XP
Anyway, I still have more of your links to finish reading. Hehe. It’s been very fascinating to to look into. ^_^
Well, welcome to the site and anime in general then!
I'd love to read your paper about music downloads. Have you read the Long Tail by Chris Anderson its about the way economics changed with the internet, with the availability of niche markets. I haven't finished it yet, but so far its interesting.
Still, I can understand how places like iTunes are making money, but I'm not as sure how well creators will benefit from it. Like, yes, its easier for the "little" guy to get their creative materials out there, but it's also harder for someone to live off of their creative products.
People like iTunes also benefit, because it's of no cost to them to produce the piece, they are only selling it. The American anime companies do have the cost of subtitling, dubbing, converting to digital video, etc.
So, I don't know, I expect anime delivery will be changing soon.
Thanks for your intelligent and well-written reply Sabrina. Of course, I'm now going to debate with you a little.
Oh your welcome! ^_^ Being brand new here I wasn’t sure what kind of response to get so I’m thrilled to see how you’ve responded. And now that you have I shall attempt to solidify or rather clarify my points based on your responses.
For starters it will probably help to know that I am not really a huge anime fan, in fact I have not one DVD on account of only starting to watch anime two days ago. My responses and stance come completely from being an interested party in business and marketing. So I’ve written up a paper that was quite similar on the debate over downloading music. Which was at first fought against quite heavily by the industry.
So I could see the similarities of how downloading was hurting anime as the same points or rather similar ones were used in the argument against illegal downloading of music. As a user of legitimate services such as iTunes, I can understand and appreciate the need to support the artist just as I also understand the need to work on closing the gap between illegal downloading vs. legal.
I still am a firm believer that closing that gap is the responsibility of the businesses more than that of the consumers. Yes there are those who do things illegal who have no intention of paying, just as I’m sure there are those who do buy it later when they can. But at the same time, if you work on getting things where people can get it, legally, many of them will. Anyway…
I thank you for the link with further information, I will have to take a moment to follow it and read up on the material you are presenting. >_> When I have more time for reading that is. Hehe.
Thanks for your intelligent and well-written reply Sabrina. Of course, I'm now going to debate with you a little
It’s an opinion that is being ignored dear, not one that isn‘t being heard. The major companies simply refuse to hear what‘s really being said here.
On one level, that’s true. I was talking more on the level of an individual title. If you only download instead of buy Fullmetal Alchemist, than you are not telling the American companies or the Japanese ones that this is a title you enjoy.
I just posted another post linking to various statements on fansubs from both sides of the ocean, and I forgot to link it to this article. I will fix that. But here it is
Ultimately in my article I wanted to stress how you can vote with your dollar, telling the Japanese companies and American ones that you want to see more of a certain type of title.
Yes, fansubs are a protest that you don't like the current delivery system, but it also cause sales to go down in America which in turn causes American companies not to buy from Japan, which means the Japanese creators will focus more on the Japanese market and "safe" subjects.
The delivery system needs to change, and I think the American companies are realizing that. But on a title to title basis, you are hurting the creator you love by not buying their American releases.
And yes, there are plenty of people out there who buy the American releases even after being watching the fansubs. Look at the popularity of Naruto. But, there are still plenty who don't. I've known "fans" who are quite proud of how little they've paid for their anime collection.
Not waiting for months or even years to get a hard copy.
Not waiting months? What if the American companies could bring the wait time down to say, three months after the Japanese release? Figuring time for proper translation, good digital quality, and because their Japanese counterparts did not want the immediate competition? Yet, fansubbers can still do it quicker. New episodes of a show can be posted by the next week. I do think that a shorter wait time would help, but its all theoretical right now, yet the American companies will have to sink a good deal of money into making that happen to find out how well it works. Gaps between releases are getting shorter and shorter, yet fansubbing still thrives and grows.
Oh my goodness… so many fallacies in your report. XD I simply can’t walk away without pointing some of them out. They’re so blaringly obvious. No offense, I‘m sure you mean well. ;-) I’m going to start here:
Keep in mind, though, that for every show or manga that you download instead of buy, that’s an opinion that’s not being heard.
That’s sounds reasonable right? I’ve heard the same spiel in all forms of media as to how downloading erodes the stability of a given means of entertainment and yet when you stop and think about this. It does not. It’s an opinion that is being ignored dear, not one that isn‘t being heard. The major companies simply refuse to hear what‘s really being said here.
Let me explain, when your fans/customers move to a quicker medium of obtaining something they enjoy, they’ve realized that there’s no need to wait for something to come out on CD or DVD and with the convenience of the Internet, people like having things at their fingertips. It is the responsibility of the businesses to adjust to meet the demands of the consumer instead of expecting them to hold to how things have always been done.
These fans who download are telling the businesses, we want our anime/music/whatever quickly and via the convenience of our own computers, not the old fashioned method I mentioned already, a hard copy release. The music industry was slow to adapt to this and yet all one has to do is look at how downloading songs for a fee is now the norm.
Well, as much as you like not having to pay, keep in mind that anime costs money to make. Every show you download is a show that doesn’t see your money as profit.
Yet again that is not accurate, the point is being missed here. The assumption is that people don’t want to pay when it’s easy to see that people are buying things legally through sources such as iTunes. So clearly consumers are willing to pay for legal downloads. So really who’s fault is that? The consumer? Nonsense, again the companies are blatantly ignoring that their target audience wants their stuff via legal downloading channels. Not waiting for months or even years to get a hard copy.
Anyway… Not to give you too much grief, but there are very basic principles to marketing and I won’t bore you with all of those but rather focus on the one that I think is relevant to this article of yours. And that would be:
Placement (or distribution): refers to how the product gets to the customer; for example, point of sale placement or retailing. This fourth P has also sometimes been called Place, referring to the channel by which a product or services is sold (e.g. online vs. retail), which geographic region or industry, to which segment (young adults, families, business people), etc.
A company survives by watching and analyzing the market to see what means and methods their consumers are using to obtain their products. You don’t survive in the business world by forcing your customers to take means they aren’t interested in just to get your product, especially when there is a better and faster means of getting it.
You instead study those trends and change your methods to match in order to keep those valuable customers. And rule number one, you never, ever, blame the consumer for changes in how things are done. Those same consumers who are downloading are not the ones who made computers, who invented the Internet, who increased the ability to be online to facilitate using downloading.
It’s silly to give them a wonderful means to be connected and then to turn around and yell at them for wishing to use it. ;-) Instead, you realize what a fantastic opportunity there is to be had in providing legal downloading in a quick and efficient manner to your customers. Clearly if these fansubers, who most likely aren’t big businesses can do it so successfully, then those who own the anime should have the real edge. After all, they are in the position of having the show before it is ever released.
And now that this went on far longer than I had planned… XD I’ll be on my way. I hope you don't mind the long reply. It was an interesting article, even if I do not completely agree with it.
I actually have a column about conventions, and I will post that tonight. Feel free to ask any more questions you have though! I helped found a small, but growing, convention, and I can assure you it is a lot of work.
You'd probably be better off to look at starting an anime club in your area first. That will let you know what kind of interest there is in your area. Try starting it at your school or local library. Then look online to see where the nearest convention is to you. If you don't live in a somewhat major city and there is a convention less than six hours from you, chances are, your hometown won't support a convention. You could try having a anime festival though, which are typically more like a day long. You won't get out of town vendors probably (unless they are only a few hours away and want to help out a small con) but you'll open your community's eyes to anime.
Yea.. I only watch a few animes online, but I mostly buy my anime/manga (lol my friends always watch crap online XD). I think I might stop watching stuff online, I heard that Geneon USA went bankrupt O_O that would suck if that happened to anymore anime companies..
might i ask something though... when it comes to anime cons... how would we go about getting them i out local area? i mean... i feel like i'm the only anime fan in this area (well, one of about 3 or 4) and i don't think an anime con can be built on 3 people... so, how would we be able to get other fans (and vendors) to get together to start one? if you could, i'd appreciate a reply, thank you *bow*
This is probably the most mature essay ive read about the industry for months. It's good to see some teens actaully seeing the world realistically. top notch.
I only watch one anime online and thats bleach but i still buy the anime & manga most of my friends watch anime online but i buy all the anime that i think is interesting & manga right now though i kinda slowing down on buying it cause im a little low on money LOL
I love this article. Lots of my friends only watch anime online and never buy anything, but I keep hearing about how much that's hurting the industry...it's rather similar to how music downloads on limewire and such are hurting CD sales, I think.
Sabrina
Otaku Archangel | Posted 03/23/08 | Reply
@CassieR:
Well, welcome to the site and anime in general then!
Thank you. ^_^
Have you read the Long Tail by Chris Anderson
Funny you should mention that… I’m actually reading it right now. XD It is a rather interesting read.
Also, it seems I need to clarify my comment about iTunes… I didn’t explain that right. I use places like Amazon more than anything, for the actual purchase. Sorry if that created any confusion. XP
Anyway, I still have more of your links to finish reading. Hehe. It’s been very fascinating to to look into. ^_^
-Sabrina
CassieR
Otakuite+ | Posted 03/22/08 | Reply
@Sabrina:
Well, welcome to the site and anime in general then!
I'd love to read your paper about music downloads. Have you read the Long Tail by Chris Anderson its about the way economics changed with the internet, with the availability of niche markets. I haven't finished it yet, but so far its interesting.
Still, I can understand how places like iTunes are making money, but I'm not as sure how well creators will benefit from it. Like, yes, its easier for the "little" guy to get their creative materials out there, but it's also harder for someone to live off of their creative products.
People like iTunes also benefit, because it's of no cost to them to produce the piece, they are only selling it. The American anime companies do have the cost of subtitling, dubbing, converting to digital video, etc.
So, I don't know, I expect anime delivery will be changing soon.
Sabrina
Otaku Archangel | Posted 03/21/08 | Reply
@CassieR:
Thanks for your intelligent and well-written reply Sabrina. Of course, I'm now going to debate with you a little.
Oh your welcome! ^_^ Being brand new here I wasn’t sure what kind of response to get so I’m thrilled to see how you’ve responded. And now that you have I shall attempt to solidify or rather clarify my points based on your responses.
For starters it will probably help to know that I am not really a huge anime fan, in fact I have not one DVD on account of only starting to watch anime two days ago. My responses and stance come completely from being an interested party in business and marketing. So I’ve written up a paper that was quite similar on the debate over downloading music. Which was at first fought against quite heavily by the industry.
So I could see the similarities of how downloading was hurting anime as the same points or rather similar ones were used in the argument against illegal downloading of music. As a user of legitimate services such as iTunes, I can understand and appreciate the need to support the artist just as I also understand the need to work on closing the gap between illegal downloading vs. legal.
I still am a firm believer that closing that gap is the responsibility of the businesses more than that of the consumers. Yes there are those who do things illegal who have no intention of paying, just as I’m sure there are those who do buy it later when they can. But at the same time, if you work on getting things where people can get it, legally, many of them will. Anyway…
I thank you for the link with further information, I will have to take a moment to follow it and read up on the material you are presenting. >_> When I have more time for reading that is. Hehe.
-Sabrina
CassieR
Otakuite+ | Posted 03/21/08 | Reply
@Sabrina:
Thanks for your intelligent and well-written reply Sabrina. Of course, I'm now going to debate with you a little
It’s an opinion that is being ignored dear, not one that isn‘t being heard. The major companies simply refuse to hear what‘s really being said here.
On one level, that’s true. I was talking more on the level of an individual title. If you only download instead of buy Fullmetal Alchemist, than you are not telling the American companies or the Japanese ones that this is a title you enjoy.
I just posted another post linking to various statements on fansubs from both sides of the ocean, and I forgot to link it to this article. I will fix that. But here it is
Ultimately in my article I wanted to stress how you can vote with your dollar, telling the Japanese companies and American ones that you want to see more of a certain type of title.
Yes, fansubs are a protest that you don't like the current delivery system, but it also cause sales to go down in America which in turn causes American companies not to buy from Japan, which means the Japanese creators will focus more on the Japanese market and "safe" subjects.
The delivery system needs to change, and I think the American companies are realizing that. But on a title to title basis, you are hurting the creator you love by not buying their American releases.
And yes, there are plenty of people out there who buy the American releases even after being watching the fansubs. Look at the popularity of Naruto. But, there are still plenty who don't. I've known "fans" who are quite proud of how little they've paid for their anime collection.
Not waiting for months or even years to get a hard copy.
Not waiting months? What if the American companies could bring the wait time down to say, three months after the Japanese release? Figuring time for proper translation, good digital quality, and because their Japanese counterparts did not want the immediate competition? Yet, fansubbers can still do it quicker. New episodes of a show can be posted by the next week. I do think that a shorter wait time would help, but its all theoretical right now, yet the American companies will have to sink a good deal of money into making that happen to find out how well it works. Gaps between releases are getting shorter and shorter, yet fansubbing still thrives and grows.
Sabrina
Otaku Archangel | Posted 03/21/08 | Reply
Oh my goodness… so many fallacies in your report. XD I simply can’t walk away without pointing some of them out. They’re so blaringly obvious. No offense, I‘m sure you mean well. ;-) I’m going to start here:
Keep in mind, though, that for every show or manga that you download instead of buy, that’s an opinion that’s not being heard.
That’s sounds reasonable right? I’ve heard the same spiel in all forms of media as to how downloading erodes the stability of a given means of entertainment and yet when you stop and think about this. It does not. It’s an opinion that is being ignored dear, not one that isn‘t being heard. The major companies simply refuse to hear what‘s really being said here.
Let me explain, when your fans/customers move to a quicker medium of obtaining something they enjoy, they’ve realized that there’s no need to wait for something to come out on CD or DVD and with the convenience of the Internet, people like having things at their fingertips. It is the responsibility of the businesses to adjust to meet the demands of the consumer instead of expecting them to hold to how things have always been done.
These fans who download are telling the businesses, we want our anime/music/whatever quickly and via the convenience of our own computers, not the old fashioned method I mentioned already, a hard copy release. The music industry was slow to adapt to this and yet all one has to do is look at how downloading songs for a fee is now the norm.
Well, as much as you like not having to pay, keep in mind that anime costs money to make. Every show you download is a show that doesn’t see your money as profit.
Yet again that is not accurate, the point is being missed here. The assumption is that people don’t want to pay when it’s easy to see that people are buying things legally through sources such as iTunes. So clearly consumers are willing to pay for legal downloads. So really who’s fault is that? The consumer? Nonsense, again the companies are blatantly ignoring that their target audience wants their stuff via legal downloading channels. Not waiting for months or even years to get a hard copy.
Anyway… Not to give you too much grief, but there are very basic principles to marketing and I won’t bore you with all of those but rather focus on the one that I think is relevant to this article of yours. And that would be:
Placement (or distribution): refers to how the product gets to the customer; for example, point of sale placement or retailing. This fourth P has also sometimes been called Place, referring to the channel by which a product or services is sold (e.g. online vs. retail), which geographic region or industry, to which segment (young adults, families, business people), etc.
A company survives by watching and analyzing the market to see what means and methods their consumers are using to obtain their products. You don’t survive in the business world by forcing your customers to take means they aren’t interested in just to get your product, especially when there is a better and faster means of getting it.
You instead study those trends and change your methods to match in order to keep those valuable customers. And rule number one, you never, ever, blame the consumer for changes in how things are done. Those same consumers who are downloading are not the ones who made computers, who invented the Internet, who increased the ability to be online to facilitate using downloading.
It’s silly to give them a wonderful means to be connected and then to turn around and yell at them for wishing to use it. ;-) Instead, you realize what a fantastic opportunity there is to be had in providing legal downloading in a quick and efficient manner to your customers. Clearly if these fansubers, who most likely aren’t big businesses can do it so successfully, then those who own the anime should have the real edge. After all, they are in the position of having the show before it is ever released.
And now that this went on far longer than I had planned… XD I’ll be on my way. I hope you don't mind the long reply. It was an interesting article, even if I do not completely agree with it.
-Sabrina
skyefur45
Otakuite | Posted 03/20/08 | Reply
It was very interesting.
Kensuke Ryumura
Otakuite+ | Posted 03/20/08 | Reply
Fascinating...
CassieR
Otakuite+ | Posted 03/20/08 | Reply
@Gray 4 God:
I actually have a column about conventions, and I will post that tonight. Feel free to ask any more questions you have though! I helped found a small, but growing, convention, and I can assure you it is a lot of work.
You'd probably be better off to look at starting an anime club in your area first. That will let you know what kind of interest there is in your area. Try starting it at your school or local library. Then look online to see where the nearest convention is to you. If you don't live in a somewhat major city and there is a convention less than six hours from you, chances are, your hometown won't support a convention. You could try having a anime festival though, which are typically more like a day long. You won't get out of town vendors probably (unless they are only a few hours away and want to help out a small con) but you'll open your community's eyes to anime.
KuroNeko7939
Otakuite | Posted 03/19/08 | Reply
Yea.. I only watch a few animes online, but I mostly buy my anime/manga (lol my friends always watch crap online XD). I think I might stop watching stuff online, I heard that Geneon USA went bankrupt O_O that would suck if that happened to anymore anime companies..
ZeelZy
Otakuite++ | Posted 03/19/08 | Reply
I love emo ninja cats
gaaragirl911
Otaku Eternal | Posted 03/19/08 | Reply
Lovin it...awesome...that's all there is to it...
(support the emo ninja cat)
Surprise me ;]
Gray 4 God
Otakuite | Posted 03/19/08 | Reply
might i ask something though... when it comes to anime cons... how would we go about getting them i out local area? i mean... i feel like i'm the only anime fan in this area (well, one of about 3 or 4) and i don't think an anime con can be built on 3 people... so, how would we be able to get other fans (and vendors) to get together to start one? if you could, i'd appreciate a reply, thank you *bow*
Kami-chan.x3
Bubblegum'd! (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 03/19/08 | Reply
LOVE THE PICTURE!! I love how you wrote it too!
devoruskie
Otakuite | Posted 03/19/08 | Reply
This is probably the most mature essay ive read about the industry for months. It's good to see some teens actaully seeing the world realistically. top notch.
The_Original_KIRA
Otakuite | Posted 03/19/08 | Reply
I only watch one anime online and thats bleach but i still buy the anime & manga most of my friends watch anime online but i buy all the anime that i think is interesting & manga right now though i kinda slowing down on buying it cause im a little low on money LOL
phosphorene
Otakuite+ | Posted 03/19/08 | Reply
I love this article. Lots of my friends only watch anime online and never buy anything, but I keep hearing about how much that's hurting the industry...it's rather similar to how music downloads on limewire and such are hurting CD sales, I think.