Come on, tell us how you really feel, Shin. No need to hold back, now!
Ah, the many tangled webs and threads of politics and all that goes with it--we, the average citizens, are the ones who have to navigate within the damn thing. I'm always weary whenever elections roll around (at least within my country), for that's when the platforms get presented, and we have to disentangle the relevant from the irrelevant.
Well, I'm not quite ready to wash my hands of the whole political scene (I'd never let myself do that), but I do tend to scrub my hands often. Keep on, Shin, for the others will not stop.
I find it rather sad actually. I mean seriously... wtf? Denying same sex marriage is fine within the actual religion, but on a governmental level? That's just wrong, period.
Yeah, we're all pretty much just as guilty as the next, so judging people like that or walking around with an holier-than-thou attitude is generally a retarded thing to do.
Yeah, I definitely understand that. I'm not a Christian anymore, but it's generally understood that we are all sinners in some way, shape or form, correct? I think a true Christian would work hard to not encourage sin while also recognizing the inherently sinful nature in everyone, including his- or herself, and taking care not to overstep their bounds and do the work of God in condemning people.
(lol, off topic, I feel like such a Christian-in-denial right now. If only it were easier for me to believe in a God. ... Not that it is particularly easy for every Christian, haha.)
I would just make sure to state on my part that the whole "homosexuality is a sin" thing is not meant to demean the individual as a human being; or, put a simpler way, I am not trying to hold myself above that person or put them down.
It goes back to the saying of "loving the sinner but hating the sin".
I don't think it is inconsistent. Again, I may not agree with Christianity's view of homosexuality, but the religion is the religion. If churches do not want to encourage what they see as "sinful behavior" by marrying gay couples, then that's their decision to make. This is a crude, perhaps overly simplistic metaphor (and I apologize in advance if it is offensive lol), but I look it at like the "No Homers Club" in The Simpsons: Yeah, it might be a prick-ish thing to do to exclude people (depending on what side you are on), but the leaders of the club have the right to include or exclude whoever they please. That is their choice.
But a government mandate takes away the choice. Unless there is a strong, STRONG reason for it, any government action that takes away freedom of choice is a terrible thing. I would be just as against a government mandate that required churches to marry gay couples as I am against this proposition.
Again, if I had my way, government would not be involved with marriage whatsoever. It would not be recognized as a legally special relationship in any way. Religious marriage would be what it is supposed to be -- a union of two people in the eyes of God -- and nothing more. Government is the domain of humanity; let God (or whoever) handle religion.
Last edited by Shinmaru at 2:44:31 AM EST on November 5, 2008.
Vagrant AI (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/05/08 | Reply
Yeah, my viewpoint on this is Christians should not be personally marrying these people (as that to me is encouraging a sinful act) but government is a different story. If people want to get a contract marriage, I don't see a big problem with that.
... but perhaps that viewpoint may be a bit inconsistent. I dunno. >.<
On the plus side . . . flights to British Columbia are still somewhat cheap, I think? I suppose that'll do for now . . . but yeah. That's really fucked. That's definitely fucked.
I was pretty upset with my country back when we did the voting thing, so I know how you feel to an extent (58% of us voted. Still irks me). All we can really say is that younger people are finally starting to take notice. In another some years, the old people'll all be off to greener pastures, and then the new thoughts can start taking over.
Gonna take a lot of time, but hey, things tend to move a lot faster these days.
Hang in there, man. We may be fucked, but we've still got some morning-afters in the plastic sprue.
Agreed. I'm watching Prop 8, and it's upsetting that it's not doing as well as it should be in a state that helped vote the first African-American president. I feel so bad for all the people who have gotten married already. Sulu D:
TimeChaser
Madman With a Box (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/05/08 | Reply
And now we in Florida have Amendment 2, so I am in tune with your anger and frustration.
Try to look on the bright side: Now we won't have Sarah Palin in the White House pushing for a federal amendment.
Bazinga!
Pleiades Rising
Otaku Idol (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/05/08 | Reply
Come on, tell us how you really feel, Shin. No need to hold back, now!
Ah, the many tangled webs and threads of politics and all that goes with it--we, the average citizens, are the ones who have to navigate within the damn thing. I'm always weary whenever elections roll around (at least within my country), for that's when the platforms get presented, and we have to disentangle the relevant from the irrelevant.
Well, I'm not quite ready to wash my hands of the whole political scene (I'd never let myself do that), but I do tend to scrub my hands often. Keep on, Shin, for the others will not stop.
SunfallE
Nyaa~ (ZE MEANIE) | Posted 11/05/08 | Reply
I find it rather sad actually. I mean seriously... wtf? Denying same sex marriage is fine within the actual religion, but on a governmental level? That's just wrong, period.
In the name of the tune I will punish you!
Miss Anonymous
Vagrant AI (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/05/08 | Reply
@Shinmaru:
Yeah, we're all pretty much just as guilty as the next, so judging people like that or walking around with an holier-than-thou attitude is generally a retarded thing to do.
And yeeep, belief in God ain't easy. XP
Shinmaru
Baron of Terribad (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/05/08 | Reply
@Miss Anonymous:
Yeah, I definitely understand that. I'm not a Christian anymore, but it's generally understood that we are all sinners in some way, shape or form, correct? I think a true Christian would work hard to not encourage sin while also recognizing the inherently sinful nature in everyone, including his- or herself, and taking care not to overstep their bounds and do the work of God in condemning people.
(lol, off topic, I feel like such a Christian-in-denial right now. If only it were easier for me to believe in a God. ... Not that it is particularly easy for every Christian, haha.)
Love thy Evangelion.
Miss Anonymous
Vagrant AI (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/05/08 | Reply
@Shinmaru:
Naw, the example is fine, no worries. lol
I would just make sure to state on my part that the whole "homosexuality is a sin" thing is not meant to demean the individual as a human being; or, put a simpler way, I am not trying to hold myself above that person or put them down.
It goes back to the saying of "loving the sinner but hating the sin".
Shinmaru
Baron of Terribad (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/05/08 | Reply
@Miss Anonymous:
I don't think it is inconsistent. Again, I may not agree with Christianity's view of homosexuality, but the religion is the religion. If churches do not want to encourage what they see as "sinful behavior" by marrying gay couples, then that's their decision to make. This is a crude, perhaps overly simplistic metaphor (and I apologize in advance if it is offensive lol), but I look it at like the "No Homers Club" in The Simpsons: Yeah, it might be a prick-ish thing to do to exclude people (depending on what side you are on), but the leaders of the club have the right to include or exclude whoever they please. That is their choice.
But a government mandate takes away the choice. Unless there is a strong, STRONG reason for it, any government action that takes away freedom of choice is a terrible thing. I would be just as against a government mandate that required churches to marry gay couples as I am against this proposition.
Again, if I had my way, government would not be involved with marriage whatsoever. It would not be recognized as a legally special relationship in any way. Religious marriage would be what it is supposed to be -- a union of two people in the eyes of God -- and nothing more. Government is the domain of humanity; let God (or whoever) handle religion.
Last edited by Shinmaru at 2:44:31 AM EST on November 5, 2008.
Love thy Evangelion.
Miss Anonymous
Vagrant AI (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/05/08 | Reply
Yeah, my viewpoint on this is Christians should not be personally marrying these people (as that to me is encouraging a sinful act) but government is a different story. If people want to get a contract marriage, I don't see a big problem with that.
... but perhaps that viewpoint may be a bit inconsistent. I dunno. >.<
Shinmaru
Baron of Terribad (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/05/08 | Reply
@SomeGuy:
I hope that ends up true. A lot of my college friends are just as angered about this as I am -- and many of them are religious.
Love thy Evangelion.
SomeGuy
Canadian Liaison (Team) | Posted 11/05/08 | Reply
On the plus side . . . flights to British Columbia are still somewhat cheap, I think? I suppose that'll do for now . . . but yeah. That's really fucked. That's definitely fucked.
I was pretty upset with my country back when we did the voting thing, so I know how you feel to an extent (58% of us voted. Still irks me). All we can really say is that younger people are finally starting to take notice. In another some years, the old people'll all be off to greener pastures, and then the new thoughts can start taking over.
Gonna take a lot of time, but hey, things tend to move a lot faster these days.
Hang in there, man. We may be fucked, but we've still got some morning-afters in the plastic sprue.
Dagger IX1
Team | Posted 11/05/08 | Reply
Yeah... I would've expected better from California. :/
Nehszriah
Hits Self With Axe (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/05/08 | Reply
Voting sucks, just period, no matter who wins and what end up going on. Will anyone care to vote next year? No. Meh.
Be true, be you and of course, be otaku.
NightBeck
Otaku Eternal | Posted 11/05/08 | Reply
Agreed. I'm watching Prop 8, and it's upsetting that it's not doing as well as it should be in a state that helped vote the first African-American president. I feel so bad for all the people who have gotten married already. Sulu D: